Jump to content

Water Ingress


andie

Recommended Posts

a few weeks ago we decided to buy a second hand caravan, new to caravaning we went to a large dealer were we bought an 94 avondale harrier, which we paid £4800. we picked it up last thursday and went away for the weekend. The bathroom for some reason had a slight musty smell which over the week end smelt more like damp.

 

Upon returning we decided to remove the tap to check for leaks and noticed a damp patch behind the panel!

 

as the cassette toilet needed resealing we thought it best to remove and reseal the components before a problem from the shower could excalate.

 

Unfortunately, the whole wall is soft and completely soaked and as it reaches almost to the roof we were worried that it is actualy water ingress rather than a problem from the shower unit which we hadn't used anyway. The water tracks behind the panel into the dining area which feels solid but again we are worried that this is a major problem. for the last two days we have had the dehumidified and think the leak has come from the rail and awning seals. It has dried out well and the wood has hardened again.

 

Can you imagine our horror, we e-mailed the dealer on sunday evening with pictures and have still got not reply. What can we do? what would you do? is our caravan worth less money now even if they fix it? we have numourous holidays booked were gutted.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi All,

 

they can't ignore you, so go to the dealer, with the 'van and sort the problem. If you don't get any satisfaction go to your local Trading Standards Dept, the number is in the book, and take their advice.

 

There are companies who try it on though, thankfully most have been weeded out, and those that haven't should be made to see their reputation suffer, via the local press. The press will be interested if you call the reporter's desk, though there should be moves to solve this problem amicably first.

 

Maybe the problem is in the process of being sorted but you will, generally receive a quicker response if you push them.

 

Don't accept any of the 'what do you expect it's an old 'van rubbish', as under The Sale Of Goods And Services Act (as amended) the 'van should be 1. suitable for the purpose, 2. As described at the time of sale, and 3. BE OF A MERCHANTABLE QUALITY!

 

 

 

Regards,

 

Ian.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Get on the phone, surely it had some sort of warranty? Why didn't the dealer do the repairs you mention?

 

 

thnks for your reply

 

we have tried the phone, we've left numerous messages and they say they will get back to us. We got that feed up we have even phoned their repair and service centre, they were helpful but advised if we get the work authorised they are booked up for the next 6 weeks!

 

We live over 2 hours away from the place, otherwise i would of taken it back by now and dumped it on their forcourt. we have be told ingress decreases the value of the van as well. What do we do! we have booked all our weekends away and paid the deposit for them, if they fix it we will miss the summer!

 

I dont want to go away in it, it smells and we've got no bathroom now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi All,

 

they can't ignore you, so go to the dealer, with the 'van and sort the problem. If you don't get any satisfaction go to your local Trading Standards Dept, the number is in the book, and take their advice.

 

There are companies who try it on though, thankfully most have been weeded out, and those that haven't should be made to see their reputation suffer, via the local press. The press will be interested if you call the reporter's desk, though there should be moves to solve this problem amicably first.

 

Maybe the problem is in the process of being sorted but you will, generally receive a quicker response if you push them.

 

Don't accept any of the 'what do you expect it's an old 'van rubbish', as under The Sale Of Goods And Services Act (as amended) the 'van should be 1. suitable for the purpose, 2. As described at the time of sale, and 3. BE OF A MERCHANTABLE QUALITY!

Regards,

 

Ian.

 

 

 

thanks Ian trading standards is our next point of call. i will keep you posted

 

 

thanks Ian trading standards is our next point of call. i will keep you posted

 

 

Just a quick question does anyone one know if the value of a van is affected by water ingress if its repaired?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If the repair is carried out to the manufacturers specification -- then there is no reason why it should have a lesser value than any other van of same age and condition. .

 

However these repairs are notoriously expensive as they just keep going on and on. .. that is why it is most important for you to get your van over to the dealer ASAP as he will no doubt say that the delay of him seeing it has made it worse etc etc.

 

Three things you must do. ..

 

1 Telephone and report your dissatisfaction.

 

2. Write to the dealer with photographs giving him a time limit in which to respond -- record or take the letter.

 

3. Get the van over to the dealer so that they can inspect it -- inform him in the letter that you will be bringing it over on a day - date and time.

 

Keep a note of the telephone calls and copies of the letters etc.

 

These things can all be backed up by ringing the Caravan Club -- if you are a member -- if not join now - and speaking to the legal help line -- they will inform you of any other actions to take. ..

 

 

At the moment your van is worth zilch -- till it is repaired. ...

Volvo S60 D5 (now sold 😥) new Vauxall soon
Happy to meet, Sorry to part, Happy to meet again
48 Year Member of The Caravan Club

Link to comment
Share on other sites

cheers fibre,

 

joined the caravan club last week, i didn't think of trying them so will try that next. have taken loads of photo's and they are shocking. Have sent loads of e-mails and will now print a letter and sent it recorded delivery. Have just phoned the dealer again for the 4th time and they said they would get back to me by the end of today, but im not holding my breath. I wonder how they didn't spot this?? we have an excuse of not knowing what were doing at least. If they fix the problem would you be happy with that or would you ask for a reduction in the price you had paid?

 

 

thanks again

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If they fix it then you have a van which should be the same value as any other van for its age and type -- the price you paid for it was the deal --- wether it was high or low that is between you and the dealer. .

 

Been down this path. .. Keep records . . dont get mad. ..

 

best of luck

Volvo S60 D5 (now sold 😥) new Vauxall soon
Happy to meet, Sorry to part, Happy to meet again
48 Year Member of The Caravan Club

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you,

 

have had an e-mail from the dealer, he advised is seeing what they can do for us and will call tomorrow to try and reslove, so i'll keep you posted. I haven't got angry yet, just penny less and upset. I even think they might of been more shocked at our findings than us.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you,

 

have had an e-mail from the dealer, he advised is seeing what they can do for us and will call tomorrow to try and reslove, so i'll keep you posted. I haven't got angry yet, just penny less and upset. I even think they might of been more shocked at our findings than us.

 

hi Andie,

 

I'm glad you've received a reply, that is positive, however you must be firm and forcefull, without shouting and losing your temper. If you lose your temper then they have the upper hand and an excuse to ask you to leave with the result you are on the backfoot.

 

As an example, you state that 'he is seeing what he can do for you'. No, he must do the correct thing by you, this is not a favour! The second point is 'try to resolve'. Once again. NO, he will resolve as required under consumer legislation!

 

It is not normal to need to become forcefull if the company play the game, remember who is in the right here.

 

It sounds, to me like they are not only shocked, but somebody who bought in the 'van without doing a thorough damp test will have a good kick up the a**e,

 

Regards,

 

Ian.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks Ian,

 

I feel like crying and crying more now, because we have just discovered that the whole end, bathroom and other side are rotten through, much more worse than we thought, so now im not sure if we should just take it back, its a lot of money and i feel sickened. Your right about the damp test, we can understand the bathroom getting missed because it was under a plastic fitting. The other bits we have found is black staining under all the seals in the cupboard and the walls are completly spongy, bits we have be advised to check and just found.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks Ian,

 

I feel like crying and crying more now, because we have just discovered that the whole end, bathroom and other side are rotten through, much more worse than we thought, so now im not sure if we should just take it back, its a lot of money and i feel sickened. Your right about the damp test, we can understand the bathroom getting missed because it was under a plastic fitting. The other bits we have found is black staining under all the seals in the cupboard and the walls are completly spongy, bits we have be advised to check and just found.

 

Hi Andie,

 

I have just spent 5 mins answering you and my reply seems to have disappeared.

Basically, don't forget being forceful without losing your temper. I know it sounds daft but write down everything you need to say and refer to it if it makes you feel better. You need to compile evidence not only written but even better, photographicaly, the written evidence in the first instance can be the notes you are using, and the photos can be in the first instance on a digital camera.

 

I know, at this moment, you may feel that the whole dealership is against you but, if they're reputable, you will wonder what you ever worried about when you actually talk to them.

 

This is by no means an excuse, but to the dealership your major problem is nothing more than just a nuisance as all their returns 'vans are, (unless they are new and under manufacturer's warranty). So it is down to you to make them realise the serious nature of your problem.

 

Don't forget though that even if the dealership were to be totally disinterested you have the fall back of the Sale of Goods and Services Act and therefore consumer law on your side,

 

good luck,

 

Ian.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

oh sorry Ian, but thanks again

 

i think its the what if's and not knowing stage thats fustrating. I have sent about 6 e-mail to them now, detailing the findings and a load of digital pics. i have ensured my tact and cool at all times, i work in complaints department for a bank, so i should be good at this? how diffrent it is though when its yourself !! i feel like a helpless child not knowing where to start or what to say.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

on a funny note Ian i have noticed that when people post, it gives there car and caravan make so this is mine.

 

 

 

 

Renault lagauna tourer estate 1. 9 tdi : Avondale harrier chassis and morning sticks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

received an e-mail from the dealer this morning offering us £150 to fix the van ourselfs, or they will do it in july and we will have the van back in august some time.

 

Phoned them because i dont think they relise what damage the water ingress has done. Was told that there was no one there to take my call.

 

Phoned again and got to speak to a manager who said he didnt receive our pictures or e-mail last night. He said he will cal back after he has had his daily meeting, i've re-sent the emails again. He also said that we have had no response from the Aftercare team because the girl has lost her voice!! Am i thick or do you really need a voice to send an e-mail.

 

I dont know if its worth waiting for the repairs to be done, because the summer will of been and gone! Can't get through to the caravan club legal line at moment, i need to know if we are able to get a refund or if they have to exchange. Do you think this is the best option?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

phoned helpline,

 

very helpful, pretty much the same as your advise guys. Just hope i don't have to take the next step.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Andie,

 

Iwould suggest that you need legal advice and fast Iwould say that £4800 is not a small amount to pay so the Caravan should be fit for purpose. I would get onto your local trading standards and the citizens advice bureau ask what they think your options are. You may be better rejecting the caravan outright rahter than letting then attempt to do repairs As I said seek professional advice before you do anything.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Andie

 

If you have financed the purchase in anyway ie: credit card for deposit or HP through the dealer contact the respective company and inform them that you are rejecting the goods due to them being not of merchantable quality, they are as liable as the suppling dealer and are in breach of contract.

 

As previous posts stay calm and outline in a letter to the dealer that you are rejecting the van on the above grounds and that all monies that you have paid to them are repaid to you within 7 days (stipulate the exact date you require), on that date you will also return the van to them, also list all your expenses so far in your attempts to get this issue addressed and remedied, add any deposits etc that you will loose or have lost, your time is valuable so charge accordingly and finally add a reasonable figure for loss of use and enjoyment of your defective purchase.

 

My personal advise is to return the van and get your money back, you'll never be happy with this van as you will be expecting and waiting for the next problem which will diminish the enjoyment you should expect from your purchase.

 

This dealer has so far shown contempt for you in the slow reaction to this problem and does not deserve your or anyone elses business.

 

Keep copies of everything that you send to them or any other parties involved. As a last resort you can go to the Small Claims Court as the purchase is below 5000. 00

 

I hope it all works out OK for you.

 

Chris

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi andie,

 

just a thought, regarding rejection of the 'van, take into account that the repair should be as good as new, whereas if you reject you may end up with a similar problem. From what you say the whole rear end needs to be renewed,

 

Ian.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

thanks for all your advise and support.

 

My husband made some more calls to them and they told him there was nothing they could do until next tuesday when the director came back of his holiday.

 

As you can imagine i just got so upset so i called them myself, they are now comming to pick the van up on monday, they will take it back and have a look at what needs doing. Hopefully they will fix it, but it could be weeks couldn't it? it is all rotten at the back in side the cupboards and the bathroom so how long i wonder? I think as long as i know its fixed then i'll accept that as long as its done asap.

 

I do feel put off now and would be scared of having to start looking for a new van all over again. looks like were back to tents and slugs for now.

 

 

 

 

 

Ian do you have any idea how long a whole back end would take to replace? then the awning rails need to be resealed etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi andie,

 

just a thought, regarding rejection of the 'van, take into account that the repair should be as good as new, whereas if you reject you may end up with a similar problem. From what you say the whole rear end needs to be renewed,

 

Ian.

Andie

 

If you can speak to your local Trading standards before Monday regarding your position and take their advise, once they have the van back you are in a weaker position as it can be deemed that you are willing and accept for them to repair it.

 

The description of the problem areas you have given does seem to be pretty extensive, there is a point where the van will become uneconomical to repair for this dealer, and unless as others have mentioned repaired as new, you will have to live with it when they return the "repaired" van, if there is still damp your position will be a lot weaker as you will have accepted their offer of repair.

 

It is easy for us to give you our advise and opinions but you have to be detached from this and think what you would advise a friend in this position, unwelcome a thought as it is there is no room for sentiment in your present position, would you be as benevolent if someone just mugged you for 4800. 00.

 

Good Luck

 

Chris

 

Andie

 

Here is some useful links to Watchdog

 

http://www. bbc. co. uk/consumer/guides_to/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

thanks for all your advise and support.

 

My husband made some more calls to them and they told him there was nothing they could do until next tuesday when the director came back of his holiday.

 

As you can imagine i just got so upset so i called them myself, they are now comming to pick the van up on monday, they will take it back and have a look at what needs doing. Hopefully they will fix it, but it could be weeks couldn't it? it is all rotten at the back in side the cupboards and the bathroom so how long i wonder? I think as long as i know its fixed then i'll accept that as long as its done asap.

 

I do feel put off now and would be scared of having to start looking for a new van all over again. looks like were back to tents and slugs for now.

Ian do you have any idea how long a whole back end would take to replace? then the awning rails need to be resealed etc.

Hi Andie and welcome to the forum :)

So far you have been given very sound advice. I realise you are upset however, take the 2 pronged approach ie:as well as contacting the dealer it is my experience that you contact Trading Standards as well then tell the dealer that you have done so, BTW ref: my other posts NAME THE DEALER! please. I don't care who or what he is, it is in our interests to know who the cowboys are and either drive them out of business or get them to get their act together. I'm sure you have 100% support from this forum as well as mine

Good luck and keep us posted :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

cheers,

 

all ive done today is get upset about it, ive just emptied the van and e-mailed the sites we've booked to cancel, the tears keep coming and my face is sore. Although they said they will pick the van up monday and take it from there i feel its going to be the longest week til then and loads of others to come and why has it taken 3 days for them to decide that. The customer service stoped once we handed over our cash. For the sakes of others and the pain im suffering they will be named and shamed to the appropiate bodies. I feel bitter !! we didn't have much money be were advised to go for this particular van ( more money than we wanted to spend) so scraped our overdraft funds and borrowed more again. watch this space

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Andie,

 

Don't get too worried yet. I've had damp in a van before and repairs can be made, the results being better than you bought in the first place. My advice would be to accept a repair, complete with a one year guarantee on that work and a full detailed damp survey of the rest of the van. However, I would also insist that your repair is put to the front of the queue. Accept nothing less. They can out source your repair if needs be, believe me major dealers do this all the time and there are independent repairers who are approved by manufacturers for this purpose.

 

Whatever you do, don't accept £150, which I believe was their offer. I would guess from your description that this repair will cost somewhere in the region of £2000. Maybe more.

 

You've paid a lot of money for the van, one thing to be thankfull is that it is from a dealer. If you'd bought privately, it would have been sold as seen and you'd have no option but to scrap the van or pay for the repair yourself.

 

P. S. Insist they re-seal both awning rails, all window rails and any other rails on the body. They owe it to you!

 

Regards

 

Buster

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks Buster, your right i got a quote from a local repair place yesturday just as an idea of moneys involved, this was before we found it was totally rotten, he said for the each rail corner £130 but he warned us it might be rotten inside so it wouln't be a case of just the resealing, it could be a few weeks and £1000's later. He told us were to look to judge the damage and god there it was, by just looking under the seals in the opposite cupboard, they had come un stuck anyway, but a load of rot started to fall onto the shelfs. We hadn't noticed before, but the back was is like a sponge.

 

I do hope they will put it right before i have to go down the nasty road and tarnish their reputation.

 

should i be happy with waiting until monday ?

 

 

how long do you think this work will take ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...