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B+E Test And Licence Law Changes 2013/4


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I hope this will be useful especially for those with post 1997 licences

 

There have been a few changes over the last 12 months and another which was supposed to start 01/01/2014 but has been postponed for a few weeks . ......

 

The change that came into force in 2013 was that trailers for the B+E test MUST be loaded with either 600 kgs in bags of sand or 1 x 1000 litre water (1000 kgs) IBC

The trainers for the B+E now have their trailers permanently loaded with this weight

 

Caravans are now by default excluded unless they can be securely loaded with that weight but I have never seen anyone use a caravan for the test so perhaps its a mute point

 

The other change, currently postponed for a few weeks, is an EU directive where having a MANUAL in any of the categories listed below will upgrade all the rest in those categories to MANUAL if they are AUTO with ONE EXCEPTION . .... the B manual will not upgrade a B+E auto to manual

The affected categories - B B+E C1 C1+E D1 D1+E C D C+E D+E

 

It is hoped that a change in UK law at some point in the future will bring the B manual upgrading B+E auto to manual into force as it is currently in Northern Ireland.

 

 

The rest of the test and supervising rules remain generally the same for B+E but the reversing area got smaller over 12 months ago - no problems recorded with that

 

SUPERVISING A B+E LEARNER

In April 2010 new rules were introduced for those supervising certain learner drivers but they only affected those supervising VOCATIONAL categories such as C1 C1+E D1 & D1+E where the supervising driver had those categories given to them for free when they passed a pre 1997 car test.

They do not affect those with a pre 1997 B+E licence who wish to supervise a B+E learner.

All B licence holders have B+E provisional on the paper part of their licence and can tow an empty or loaded trailer on all roads including motorways.

The usual rules apply when a learner is driving -

The supervising driver must be aged over 21

The supervising driver must have held a B+E licence for at least 3 years

L plates must be fitted to the front of the vehicle and the rear of the trailer

Correct insurance for a B+E learner

 

The B+E test

No medical or theory test required

Read a number plate from a certain distance

VIDEO - Show Me Tell Me Questions - usually 5

The next three can be in any order:-

VIDEO - Reversing Exercise - done in test centre grounds if test conducted from practical test centre - some tests are now being done from training school grounds

DSA REVERSING TEST AREA DIAGRAM

VIDEO - Uncouple/couple up - done in test centre grounds if test conducted from practical test centre - some tests are now being done from training school grounds

One hour road drive - includes the independent drive and is done virtually the same as the basic car test

 

The trailer must now be loaded with 600 kgs of sand bags or a 1000 kgs water IBC for the test so most companies are now training with that weight in the trailer

 

Well explained here

 

DISCLAIMER - I have no connection to any companies which may be featured in those videos

 

This is interesting BUT NOT RECOMMENDED – a B licence towing set up can be presented for the B+E test but L plates must be used for the test. So you can train yourself, go to test by yourself, fit L plates, do the test, then, pass or fail, remove L plates and drive away by yourself.

DSA B+E TEST AND VEHICLE/TRAILER REQUIREMENTS

 

 

 

TOWING ON A B LICENCE (all B only licence holders)

Towing a trailer or caravan over 750 kgs MAM / MTPLM on a B licence (without B+E) now requires one extra rule to be adhered to on top of the usual towing rules and that is . ...

The vehicle GVW added to the trailer MAM or caravan MTPLM must not total more than 3500 kgs

 

 

I hope this was useful

 

 

 

 

 

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Thanks, good information there.

 

I'm a post 97 licence holder and it annoys me that I can legally tow with one of our cars but not the other.

Just beginning our adventure. 95% of my time on CT I use my phone. As a result correct spelling and grammer will be used sparingly. This is due to fat fingers. Please don't let it bother you.

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Why do we need an EU Directive to alter licence categories?

Do members of the EU Commission tow caravans/trailers?

What has UK driver licensing laws to do with the EU?

 

Is the Secretary of State for Transport now an EU delegate?

Grrrrrrr!!

 

Regards.

Col

Proud to be a Patriot and CT Ninja
I get the feeling that beneath your sesquipedalian loquaciousness you're the same kind of fundamentalist intent on winning arguments through Argumentum Verbosium.

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Why do we need an EU Directive to alter licence categories?

Do members of the EU Commission tow caravans/trailers?

What has UK driver licensing laws to do with the EU?

 

Is the Secretary of State for Transport now an EU delegate?

Grrrrrrr!!

 

Regards.

Col

Because we are a part of the EU Col, remember. ....

Just think if it were not for the EU all these people would be having different standards and categories to us and when they came over here it would be chaos!

 

Harmonisation of licences across the EU is a good thing I think.

Has the revolution finally begun?

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Hi chaps. It is referred to as 'All singing off of the same hymn sheet'. That is all well and dandy if those that are in the choir can read,never mind sing.

Life in general can be a journey of chance with some winners and sadly some losers. Your outfit can never be left to chance. A short-while carrying out essential checks can ensure a long-time of happy & safe caravanning for all concerned.
Ignorance can often be bliss but is certainly not an excuse and when continually disregarded they can be totally disastrous for oneself and the innocent parties.

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Another valuable information will be lost in EU debate. moderators wake up please.

Can you be specific please?

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Why do we need an EU Directive to alter licence categories?

Do members of the EU Commission tow caravans/trailers?

What has UK driver licensing laws to do with the EU?

 

Is the Secretary of State for Transport now an EU delegate?

Grrrrrrr!!

 

Regards.

Col

 

As I see it, it's more a matter of clearing up a few loose ends that remained. I would have thought automatic upgrading of a B+E automatic to manual if the B licence was passed on a manual vehicle is something to be welcomed. Nothing much else has changed to the licence categories themselves so it'll only affect a very small percentage of licence holders anyway. I really don't see any reason to get upset about the changes as they are no big deal.

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There have been a few changes over the last 12 months and another which was supposed to start 01/01/2014 but has been postponed for a few weeks . ......

 

The change that came into force in 2013 was that trailers for the B+E test MUST be loaded with either 600 kgs in bags of sand or 1 x 1000 litre water (1000 kgs) IBC

 

 

Caravans are now by default excluded unless they can be securely loaded with that weight but I have never seen anyone use a caravan for the test so perhaps its a mute point

 

The other change, currently postponed for a few weeks, is an EU directive where having a MANUAL in any of the categories listed below will

 

The trailer must now be loaded with 600 kgs of sand bags or a 1000 kgs water IBC for the test so most companies are now training with that weight in the trailer

 

I hope this was useful

 

 

 

 

 

Isn't the requirement only that the trailer must be a box type trailer, at least as wide as the towing vehicle, and at least 800kg MAM?

 

An empty box van trailer may need to be loaded to the correct weight but a caravan with an MPTLM of 800kg+ will be suitable

but driving instructors prefer the box van layout as permanent instruction unit.

Edited by beejay
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Isn't the requirement only that the trailer must be a box type trailer, at least as wide as the towing vehicle, and at least 800kg MAM?

 

An empty box van trailer may need to be loaded to the correct weight but a caravan with an MPTLM of 800kg+ will be suitable

but driving instructors prefer the box van layout as permanent instruction unit.

It must be at least 1000 MAM and it must contain a load of either 600 sand or 1000 water

 

This means that a trailer with a MAM of 1100 and an unladen weight of 600 cannot be used because it cannot be loaded with the minimum 600 of sand

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So does part of the test consist of a trip to a weighbridge?

not unless the examiner suspects something is amiss

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I'm just glad I passed my test in the 80's. ................. :unsure::unsure:

I refer you to the Rt Hon Member for the 19th Century.....................pictured just to the left of your screen..................

 

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It must be at least 1000 MAM and it must contain a load of either 600 sand or 1000 water

 

This means that a trailer with a MAM of 1100 and an unladen weight of 600 cannot be used because it cannot be loaded with the minimum 600 of sand

 

 

Got a link to these requirements please ? Nothing turn up with a search and DSA/VOSA websites have nothing about it.

 

I was informed that as a caravan is "loaded" by virtue of its design it is acceptable with a MAM of 1000kg or more (sorry - 800 kg was an error by me).

 

Strange that 600 kg of bagged sand is the 'equivalent' of 1000 litres of water which, with the container weight, will be well over 1000kg .

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Got a link to these requirements please ? Nothing turn up with a search and DSA/VOSA websites have nothing about it.

 

I was informed that as a caravan is "loaded" by virtue of its design it is acceptable with a MAM of 1000kg or more (sorry - 800 kg was an error by me).

 

Strange that 600 kg of bagged sand is the 'equivalent' of 1000 litres of water which, with the container weight, will be well over 1000kg .

 

Hi beejay. The last time I weighed water a litre was 1kg!!!!!!!!!!!!!!?? Therefore,on that basis 1000kgs would be 1000ltrs. Likewise,therefore 600kgs of bagged sand is only 600kgs and not not equivalent to 1000ltrs of water or 1000kgs.

Life in general can be a journey of chance with some winners and sadly some losers. Your outfit can never be left to chance. A short-while carrying out essential checks can ensure a long-time of happy & safe caravanning for all concerned.
Ignorance can often be bliss but is certainly not an excuse and when continually disregarded they can be totally disastrous for oneself and the innocent parties.

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And why bags of sand, and not bags of gravel? Or Feathers? 600 Kg is 600 Kg.


 

Hi beejay. The last time I weighed water a litre was 1kg!!!!!!!!!!!!!!??

Was the water temperature exactly 21 degrees then?

Has the revolution finally begun?

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And why bags of sand, and not bags of gravel? Or Feathers? 600 Kg is 600 Kg.

Was the water temperature exactly 21 degrees then?

 

Hi Trevor. Now behave, ;) I think that you are splitting hairs here or maybe hares!!!

Actually, it was earlier this Summer so it would have been really quite a bit warmer than yesterday when I posted my reply :rolleyes: .

 

Bags of sand are open to being punctured and absorbing moisture and therefore will only get heavier but they are easy to handle simply because of the fact that they will mould to your hands.

Feathers are extremely bulky and again if the bags were punctured they would become rather soggy and gain weight !!!!

As for gravel,well, extremely heavy duty bags would be required and not really offer any tangible advantage over sand.

Life in general can be a journey of chance with some winners and sadly some losers. Your outfit can never be left to chance. A short-while carrying out essential checks can ensure a long-time of happy & safe caravanning for all concerned.
Ignorance can often be bliss but is certainly not an excuse and when continually disregarded they can be totally disastrous for oneself and the innocent parties.

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Hi beejay. The last time I weighed water a litre was 1kg!!!!!!!!!!!!!!?? Therefore,on that basis 1000kgs would be 1000ltrs. Likewise,therefore 600kgs of bagged sand is only 600kgs and not not equivalent to 1000ltrs of water or 1000kgs.

 

:unsure: Note the inverted commas . ....... "equivalent". And yes, 1000kg of water is 1000 litres but it has to be in container(s)

 

So to put it more simply. ......... B)

The difference in weight is huge so why not 600 kg of sand or water - or - 1000 kg of sand or water?

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I think that IBCs of 600 litres are hard to come by which is why the alternative of 1000 was used

 

ASLO - many B+E courses are done within LGV schools where 1000 IBCs are used for the loads

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I think the amounts of sand and water are more to do with volume than anything else. Both 1000 KG's of water and 600KG's of sand equates to 1 cubic meter of volume, which allowing for the container and room to fill it, defines the minimum internal volume of the trailer that can be used.

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This is madness.

 

Two of my daughters have passed their B+E test using a caravan and the examinor didn't bat and eyelid. I have another daughter who has no need at present to tow but will want to in the future. Does this mean that i have to hire a trailer and fill it? Madness!!!!!!

Personally, I think this smacks of 'jobs for the boys' insomuch as we are being forced to use a company that has the requisite trailer duly loaded.

I have no doubt this will become law (if it isn't already) but for goodness sake! People can already tow without a B+E licence - this is the 'difficult' bit, not the fact that the trailer is slightly heavier :angry:

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This is madness.

 

Two of my daughters have passed their B+E test using a caravan and the examinor didn't bat and eyelid. I have another daughter who has no need at present to tow but will want to in the future. Does this mean that i have to hire a trailer and fill it? Madness!!!!!!

Personally, I think this smacks of 'jobs for the boys' insomuch as we are being forced to use a company that has the requisite trailer duly loaded.

I have no doubt this will become law (if it isn't already) but for goodness sake! People can already tow without a B+E licence - this is the 'difficult' bit, not the fact that the trailer is slightly heavier :angry:

I agree that now it is virtually impossible without a lot of effort and cost for a driver to privately go for the B+E

 

Needs a trailer. ..

That is at least 1000 plated MAM, at least 800 actual weight when loaded with either 600 sand or 1000 water IBC

 

Is there a box trailer that is as light as 200 when empty because if not it makes the 800 rule mute?

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I think the amounts of sand and water are more to do with volume than anything else. Both 1000 KG's of water and 600KG's of sand equates to 1 cubic meter of volume, which allowing for the container and room to fill it, defines the minimum internal volume of the trailer that can be used.

 

 

A cubic metre of dry sand weighs between 1200 and 1600 kg depending on grain size.

 

1000 litre of water in an IBC makes sense as it fills it completely and avoids movement. So why not 1000kg of sand?

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