Towing With A 1.5 Diesel Renault Scenic?

[Bailey Stu]

Hi all,

I am considering part exchanging my Ford S-max 2. 0 TDCi for a Renault Grand Scenic1. 5 DCi Dynamique TomTom. I know that a 1. 5 diesel engine will not have the 'pulling power' of the 2. 0 ford engine, but having just had to change the wife's Clio runabout car, I need to keep costs down.

 

According to the online tow car matcher, the 1. 5 Scenic is an 82% match for my Bailey Orion 1130kg, and the braked towing limit of the Scenic is 1300kg, which we're within. We don't tend to tow great distances, except an annual pilgrimage to the wine growing regions of France, and a few local trips 3 or 4 times a year.

 

Does anyone have any experience of towing with a 1. 5 diesel engine with a fairly lightweight caravan?

 

Your thoughts would be most welcome!

 

Stu

[Steamdrivenandy]

Stu,

 

I'm afraid you're quoting the wrong figure for matching purposes, 1130kg is the empty MIRO weight of your 450 and it's the maximum loaded (MTPLM) 1287kg that is used for the matching % calculation. You seem to have arrived at the correct % though. The 5 seat version of 'your' car has a 1385kg kerbweight giving 82% and the 7 seat version's kerbweight is 1430kg giving a ratio of 79%.

 

Earlier Renault models with the 1. 5 engine always seemed to have very low tow limits but this may not have been because of the engine, it could have been because the rest of the drivetrain or the body weren't up to dragging higher weights or maybe the engine has been beefed up recently.

 

I'd recommend a read through http://www. honestjohn. co. uk/carbycar/renault/scenic-plus-grand-scenic-2009/, although he hasn't much to say about the 1. 5 as his road tests were on other engines in the range.

[Wunny]

If this is any help.

 

My 1. 6 Hdi Xsara Picasso tows my Orion 440-4 with ease. It returns an average 38mpg when towing, 61. 4 when not towing.

[beejay]

Hi all,

I am considering part exchanging my Ford S-max 2. 0 TDCi for a Renault Grand Scenic1. 5 DCi Dynamique TomTom. I know that a 1. 5 diesel engine will not have the 'pulling power' of the 2. 0 ford engine, but having just had to change the wife's Clio runabout car, I need to keep costs down.

 

According to the online tow car matcher, the 1. 5 Scenic is an 82% match for my Bailey Orion 1130kg, and the braked towing limit of the Scenic is 1300kg, which we're within. We don't tend to tow great distances, except an annual pilgrimage to the wine growing regions of France, and a few local trips 3 or 4 times a year.

 

Does anyone have any experience of towing with a 1. 5 diesel engine with a fairly lightweight caravan?

 

Your thoughts would be most welcome!

 

Stu

 

 

Renault's towing limit for the Scenic range assumes that the car is not loaded to GVW.

 

You need to subtract the caravan MAM from the Scenic Gross Train Weight to see what the car can weigh when towing.

 

According to the Renault website

GTW is 3301 kg

GVW is 2001 kg

towing limit with driver only is 1300 kg .

 

Any additional weight in the car will have to come off the towing limit.

Edited December 8, 2013 by beejay

[Steamdrivenandy]

Apparently Skoda are now quoting kerbweights without a driver allowance on their new models. I don't know if it's the same for the whole VW Group? Mind you with a Bentley, who cares

 

Rather messes up the 85% suggestion though.

[xtrailman]

How long have Renault been giving 4 year warranty's?

 

http://carleasingmadesimple. com/personal-car-leasing/renault/grand-scenic-diesel-estate_3/54335/technical-data/?4810N

 

It should be able to tow a light caravan, providing beejay advice is followed.

And return 60mpg on a run solo?

 

If the TomTom is anything like the Mazda version, then its not very good, and the "live" traffic on the Mazda has to be renewed every year!, I got a 90 day free trail, no mention in the brochure, the TT is generally considered poor, its rubbish compared to the Nissan I had.

[Lutz]

 

 

Renault's towing limit for the Scenic range assumes that the car is not loaded to GVW.

 

You need to subtract the caravan MAM from the Scenic Gross Train Weight to see what the car can weigh when towing.

 

According to the Renault website

GTW is 3301 kg

GVW is 2001 kg

towing limit with driver only is 1300 kg .

 

Any additional weight in the car will have to come off the towing limit.

 

If the GTW is 3301kg and the GVW is 2001kg, then the towing limit is 1300kg even when the car is fully laden, and not just with the driver only.

[Lutz]

Apparently Skoda are now quoting kerbweights without a driver allowance on their new models. I don't know if it's the same for the whole VW Group? Mind you with a Bentley, who cares

 

Rather messes up the 85% suggestion though.

 

In the strict sense of the term kerbweight, it is always without the driver. Those that quote with the driver are actually referring to Mass in Service (or MIRO), not kerbweight.

 

On the other hand, the 75kg allowance for the driver is not going to make a difference to the weight ratio that anyone would notice in practice.

[Steamdrivenandy]

I agree Lutz but it's interesting that Skoda say a new 1. 4TSi Hatch can pull up to 1500kg and only has a kerbweight of 1180kg, meaning that if someone took that literally they'd have a ratio of 127%. The 75kg driver allowance would bump that to 120%.

 

If an owner stuck to the 85% UK recommendation they'd only pull a 1000kg caravan, a whole 500kg below the limit Skoda say it can pull.

[xtrailman]

The limits are for a braked trailer, not a caravan as such, you also have to apply common sense.

[beejay]

 

If the GTW is 3301kg and the GVW is 2001kg, then the towing limit is 1300kg even when the car is fully laden, and not just with the driver only.

 

That's what one would assume. Renault have always had a problem with the way in which they quote towing limits. There are old threads on this where the GTW - GVW did restrict the loading of the car if the towing limit was to be achieved.

 

http://www. caravantalk. co. uk/community/topic/18552-renault-grand-scenic-for-towing/

 

It is true that the figures I used do not make sense on this occasion but I quoted what the Renault brochure - page 18 - states

 

http://brochures. renault. co. uk/PDF/ScenicFamily. pdf

 

Towing limit (driver only) 1300 kg.

 

The unbraked trailer towing limit (driver only) varies between 720/730/750 kg depending on trim level. Strangely, the heaviest kerb weight has the heaviest trailer limit!

[Lutz]

It seems that brochures are often put together by people who excel in sales blurb rather than possessing technical competence. I also get the impression that text is often carried over from previous brochures without further thought or consultation with the engineers. It's true that Renault used to have maximum permissible towloads that were greater than the difference between max. GVW and max. GTW, but I think that is no longer the case.

At least until fairly recently, Vauxhall also had max. towload information on their website which made as little sense as that published by Renault. No doubt these two manufacturers aren't the only ones.

[beejay]

 

At least until fairly recently, Vauxhall also had max. towload information on their website which made as little sense as that published by Renault.

 

 

Must have applied equally to Opel then as Vauxhall specs have been Opel generated for years and Vauxhall lost its publicity and printing departments years ago. ................................

[Lutz]

 

 

Must have applied equally to Opel then as Vauxhall specs have been Opel generated for years and Vauxhall lost its publicity and printing departments years ago. ................................

 

Although Opel has overall engineering and manufacturing responsibility within GM Europe, all local marketing organisations, including Vauxhall, are responsible for their own publications and specifications. Opel Germany is responsible for Germany only. Standard equipment and available factory fitted options for models sold by Opel Ireland, for example, may be totally different to that for the same model in its home market and this will be reflected in local brochures, but the technical data will always come from headquarters in Rüsselsheim. However, Opel engineers will never receive draft issues of brochures to be published outside of Germany for the purpose of checking that the information contained therein is correct.

If Vauxhall lost its publicity and printing departments years ago, as you said, then this will have been contracted out, but not transferred to Opel in Germany.

[CommanderDave]

Renault have always been strange how they quote towing figures .

 

I owned a 1. 5 diesel Scenic a few years ago . They were light and had no power the electric windows broke and were subject to a recall for them . great on fuel was a good point though 60 MPG

 

Would I tow with one . NO . I would do some homework first .

 

 

 

Dave

[drummond]

I've an old Carlight (15/2) which has a MTPLM of 1100kg, and an ex factory weight of 889kg. I towed it behind the Renault Scenic 1. 4 petrol (don't ask!) which has a limit of 1300kg. It was good up to 55mph, but I did not overtake, well, anything.

 

Going on the A3 to Portsmouth, up the South Dówns hill, with the van more ór less empty but the car quite full, we got to the top in 4th at 50mph. "Economy" was 25mpg.

 

A diesel will undoubtedly be quicker and more economical, and as long as you're not in a great hurry, your Scenic should be OK.

Edited December 12, 2013 by drummond

[beejay]

 

 

. ........but the technical data will always come from headquarters in Rüsselsheim.

 

 

Wot I said!

 

It is probable that VM sales brochures are written up from Opel spec sheets by the publicity company contracted to do the work. Weights and dimensions are not likely to be different on European models.

 

Not sure how that works with the badge changed far Eastern imports.

Edited December 12, 2013 by beejay

[techsnap]

I towed our 1000kg MTPLM Crown Crest 4 times with our Scenic 1. 6 Petrol - and then promptly bought a 2. 0TDCi Mondeo. Love the TDCi for towing incidentally, really effortless, and it's a much 'faster' feeling car generally.

 

The Scenic made quite a decent caravanning car (nice high driving position, good storage spaces etc), but was just totally gutless for towing. That has 110bhp - depending on the version of the 1. 5dCi you are looking at, this may be more or less. Of course, the dCi will have more torque which is a good thing for towing.

 

Double-check your allowed weights though - if I remember rightly, my Scenic handbook gives a max tow weight of 900kg for a Grand Scenic with anything more than the driver on board.