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Mirrors A Legal Requirement But Not Much Good!


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To see along the side of a caravan without additional mirrors would require most towing vehicles to have a width over the standard mirrors of something over 2. 25 metres. I would like to ask which vehicles exceed this width and so do not need additional mirrors.

 

John.

 

Well said. I suspect people who think that extension mirrors do not add to the view have not adjusted them properly. Although the standard door mirrors on our Discovery (which is about as wide as normal towing vehicles get) offer a good rear view, the extensions give that vital extra down the sides - but only when adjusted correctly.

 

As for volvoman your statement re motorcyclists is the type that gets volvo drivers a bad name with motorcyclists. As has been said, in order to overtake it's necessary to pass the offside rear corner and if you don't have extension mirrors you can't see that point.

Ian.
2013 Freelander 2 SD4 Auto / 2005 Bailey Pageant Vendée; 1952 Norton ES2, 1955 Francis Barnett Cruiser 75

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As a cyclist thank you very much for your consideration. At least if you have a nearside mirror and you overtake me, you should be able to see when you are clear to pull back in and not take me out!

 

I just have to live in hope that some of the earlier posters on here who think they do not require extension mirrors can actually see the rear nearside corner of their caravan.

 

To see along the side of a caravan without additional mirrors would require most towing vehicles to have a width over the standard mirrors of something over 2. 25 metres. I would like to ask which vehicles exceed this width and so do not need additional mirrors.

 

John.

 

 

Only Joking of course, I meant cyclists in front & catching them up the backside. Though one did come up my inside whist I was sat at lights signalling left and then tried to shoot forward as light changed & realised his mistake & went on pavement. My indicators were visible on the van & my door mirrors

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I'm sorry, but if you do not have adequate vision to the rear, the motor cyclist is overtaking you and is by the rear corner of your van, you change lanes and it is his lookout!!!!! As they say, sometimes it's better to say nothing than remove all doubt.

 

 

 

 

Listen friend dont preach too me about motor cyclists. if they want too put their selves in dangerous positions then thats their lookout mirrors or no mirrors. I will look in my mirrors as an when i see fit. End of.

 

 

peter.

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Is this friendly fire or something more serious?

 

But to put my two pence worth in. ..

In the scenario mentioned, it's irreverent why or how a motorbike would end up in such a dangerous spot. Crossing broken white lines (changing lanes) is always the lane changers Lookout. .. is it not?

Regards,

Kevin

Honda F-RV towing 1999 Bailey Senator Montana

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No you dont need additonal mirrors, the additionals are to make up for when your mirrors dont reach out enough.

 

There are very few (if any) cars that are wide enough, or caravans that are narrow enough, to provide the legally required view when a caravan is coupled up.

 

As you don't know details of the OP's car and caravan stating "you don't need additional mirrors" is misleading.

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My Navara it wide and I thought I would gel along without the extra mirrors. I did for a few weeks then I was advised to get them to be legal, even though I thought I did not need them. When I put them on the first time I thought they were going to be a wast of time. But they made a massive difference. Now I would not be without them. Even on short journeys I make sure my mirrors are fitted.

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I had to buy a pair of Suck-it-&-See Mirrors as I could not find anything else to fit my Peugeot 308SW mirrors due to the shape of them.

I find them next to useless as they are so small, and can't even now use the cars mirrors due to the sucker on the glass.

I think I would be better without them but to be legal got to have towing mirrors.

Regards, David
Ford Kuga ST line 2ltr. Diesel 2017,  Bailey Pursuit 11 400/2 2018, Emove em303 motor mover, Hyundai 1000i Generator.

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Volvoman, I don't know if you are deliberately trying to wind us up, but if your posts are to be taken at face value, then your attitude sucks, IMHO.

You claim in one post that you can see "perfectly well" and then admit in the next post that you can't see down the sides of your 'van but "who needs to anyway?". Unbelievable!

I really hope I never have to share road space with you.

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O wad some power the giftie gie us, to see oursels as others see us

It wad frae monie a blunder free us, An' foolish notion.

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I use Milenco Grand Aeros on my Land Rover Defender, but as per the OP they really just replicate the view of the Defenders wing mirrors. I fit them regardless so as not to attract the attention of the old bill.

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Hi all,

 

Those who have no concern for other road users and don't think it would be their fault if cyclists/motorcyclists/pedestrians had put themselves in a dangerous position, you are of course correct and you can all go about your business with impunity after the inquest/funeral etc. Erm no, cos it doesn't work like that. You will regret not avoiding the victim and you will soul search for the rest of your life no matter who's fault it was. If you didn't feel regret then you are one hell of a piece of work. Of course there is the scenario that it could be your family member who falls foul of somebody driving without adequate rear visibility

 

I was at traffic lights when I looked in the mirror and a youth was hitching a ride on the rear handle. I was doing a left turn and he could have gone under the van but I stopped and he rode off.

 

Why not just put mirrors on? after all a fine would more than pay for them,

 

Regards,

Ian.

Edited by ian dunning

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Yet again, sound words from Mr Dunning. :)

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I can't understand the logic of some of the posters on this thread. No matter what the vehicle standard mirrors show, any mirror fitted further out (within the legal width limits) will give a better view behind the caravan. If they don't, they're not adjusted correctly. It's simple geometry like we all learned at school. Why people post that they don't want to see as much as possible is beyond me. Try driving an HGV with a full set of mirrors, six is usual, and you'll realise the more the merrier when it comes to safe, considerate driving.

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As said above it is geometric impossible to see down the outside of a caravan legally unless your mirrors tips are wider than the caravan . i use ext mirrors to see and my Commander is one of the widest on the road at 7ft 6 over the mirrors but it still not legal without towing my 7ft 6 caravan .

to be legal you have to able to see the complete side of the caravan to the rear awning rail and out to a point 4m from the caravan at a distance of 20m .

 

Dave

Edited by CommanderDave

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I have just been outside in the rain and measured the width of my car, and from mirror to mirror It's 2. 18mtr or 7ft 2! my caravan is also 7ft 2. I wondered why I have trouble parking in the multistory car park?

 

I will have to be careful that I don't exceed the max width for mirrors.

Regards,

Kevin

Honda F-RV towing 1999 Bailey Senator Montana

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I use Milenco Aeros which slightly improves the view, but I have the car's wing mirrors turned down a bit so that I can see the van's wheels when negotiating roundabouts and sharp turns.

 

Must try that,sounds a good idea Thanks !

 

As said above it is geometric impossible to see down the outside of a caravan legally unless your mirrors tips are wider than the caravan . i use ext mirrors to see and my Commander is one of the widest on the road at 7ft 6 over the mirrors but it still not legal without towing my 7ft 6 caravan .

to be legal you have to able to see the complete side of the caravan to the rear awning rail and out to a point 4m from the caravan at a distance of 20m .

 

Dave

I believe that is the law which we must abide by no matter what we "think" we can or cannot see.

Edited by bordeauxderek

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TOWING MIRRORS

The law demands that a motor vehicle must have at least two functional rear view mirrors. There must be one

on the offside and one internally, though most cars are equipped with a nearside mirror as well.

Note:

 

 

 

It may not be possible to use the car’s internal mirror to see through the caravan windows to the rear of the

combination, in which case two external mirrors are required.

Since many caravans are wider than their towing car, the side mirrors on the car are unlikely to provide a clear

view down both sides of the caravan, so extension towing mirrors are needed. You must be able to see clearly

down both sides of your caravan, and 4m either side at a distance of 20m behind the caravan.

There will be some combinations of car and caravan which can satisfy this requirement without extension towing

mirrors. However, these are likely to be the exception rather than the rule and most combinations will need

extension towing mirrors. Unless you are absolutely certain that your vision meets the legal criteria, extension

towing mirrors should always be used for legality and safety when your caravan is coupled up. Remember to

remove them when not towing.

Ensure that the extension towing mirrors project no more than

250mm* beyond the widest part of the caravan. It is desirable that

the offside extension towing mirror contains a plane mirror so that

you can judge speed and distance correctly. Also ensure that they

have safety glass and/or are e-marked, if required.

* the limit for older cars is 200mm.

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As Lefthand Down has commented on the removal of extended mirrors when not towing, I was in Derby a couple of weeks ago, following a small tilt trailer with a training company logo on it, advertising that they offer lessons for B + E, it was a narrow trailer of which was a tandem axle type with the body enclosed within the axles and the overall width of the trailer was less than the towcar, possibly a Nissan Terano? Yet he was driving around with extended mirrors on.

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So do I need them when towing with my transit van?

 

Hitch up, park so your outfit is in a straight line, stand by the rear nearside of the van, look down the side of your van to see if you can see your mirrors, repeat the same for the offside, if you can see them clearly you should be ok, this is what I watched The Boys in Blue doing at Michael Wood Services last year.

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