Motorway Speed Increase

[John_b_45]

Interesting discussion with loads of great points made for and against!

For what it's worth my view is to increase the limit to 80mph BUT, as so many have said, enforce it.

I was in France over the summer and I am amazed how sensibly the French drive compared to some years ago. I can only assume that the severe penalties imposed (on a sliding scale up to you've lost your car monsieur and it's going to cost you a lot of euros) have had an effect.

Surely similar "we mean business" legislation here would, coupled with more and more variable speed limited sections of motorway that control speed to suit traffic and conditions, make for a safer and more efficient road network here.

I was caught by a French cop parked on a motorway service exit with speed camera aimed at approaching traffic. I have to say I was showing 60mph on my speedo which probably means I was just at the legal limit in real speed terms, but I went cold for a while and wondered! He was alone in his dark blue car and I imagine the cost of the exercise was more than paid for in the fines imposed!

Pop a few unmarked cars on those never really used motorway raised ramps for police vehicles on motorways complete with cameras aimed at the traffic - move them around regularly and FINE to show you mean it! Park a few camera cars on motorway bridges - anywhere that cannot easily be identified by the sat nav camera warning system - and watch the cash roll in and speed limits better observed.

And lastly - taking a deep breath - I would love to see the towing speed raised to 60mph on ordinary roads where so often that speed is safe and appropriate and would maybe help caravanners rid themselves of the stigma of holding the world up.

[ian dunning]

Hi Beejay,

Ok I take your point on safety instead of the word fast but do you not think in response driver training that safety is the first consideration? I would hardly have been trained to drive like an irresponsible maniac through a busy town during rush hour. ...........actually I'll stop at that while I think about it .

Seriously, the point I was making is that some people drive slower than others for various reasons, some because of a lack of ability/confidence while some do so because of training over and above the minimum required to pass a test and they may be able to recognise that driving to the limit is not advisable at that time. I think that an increase in the motorway driving limit may well result in some drivers driving an extra 10mph, or more, over their ability level though i'm not sure that is a reason not to raise the limit, only time will tell,

Regards,

Ian.

[Shirker]

Several times the concept of "driver slower and be less stressed" has been mentioned but I don't see the connection - the two are entirely unlinked. Sometimes I drive at 70, sometimes I drive at 80 and it has no impact on how stressed or otherwise driving makes me*. Maybe I'm driving at 80 when time pressures are tight therefore a stress element is part of that, but that's due to time rather than speed so driving at 70 would probably only increase it.

 

*I may not be entirely normal in I find driving very relaxing no matter how busy or fast the road. Got to go from Cheltenham to Spalding in Lincolnshire, to York and back to Cheltenham today, all towing, and that's a good day in my book. I try and do days like that at least twice if not three times a week.

[AWanderingLancastrian]

Several times the concept of "driver slower and be less stressed" has been mentioned but I don't see the connection - the two are entirely unlinked. Sometimes I drive at 70, sometimes I drive at 80 and it has no impact on how stressed or otherwise driving makes me*. Maybe I'm driving at 80 when time pressures are tight therefore a stress element is part of that, but that's due to time rather than speed so driving at 70 would probably only increase it.

 

*I may not be entirely normal in I find driving very relaxing no matter how busy or fast the road. Got to go from Cheltenham to Spalding in Lincolnshire, to York and back to Cheltenham today, all towing, and that's a good day in my book. I try and do days like that at least twice if not three times a week.

 

Hi Shirker. Your notion of no stress when driving is just not making sense. In the present times of living with the ever increasing pressures of life in general the stress is created by other people & events around us.

It is a categoric fact that the faster a motor vehicle or motor cycle or for that matter a cyclist is is being propelled the greater is the stress factor to the 'Pilot'.

Anyone that can lock themselves in their own little 'Stress free bubble zone' should not be driving or riding. Take the idiot with the music system in their ears just for starters!!,never mind the plonker totally relaxed whilst creating mayhem using the mobile phone clamped to their ear. For that matter it is an ever increasing problem with cyclists & a great many ride on the footpaths,because it is safer up there.

It is tantamount to driving/Riding without Due Care & Attention. At the point of realisation & the OH *HI* moment the stress levels may be all to obvious and loss of control occurs in a big way.

Towing a caravan or horse-box/trailer on the motorways and trunk routes is not entirely a Picnic or Walk in the Park is it now?.

I have been towing (all-sorts with all-sorts) since 1966 and have chalked up thousands upon thousands of miles both in the UK and in Europe. Unless there are personal issues that create stress,in which case it is ill-advised to drive;the stresses are created by other people & events of the day or times traversed.

[Shirker]

 

Hi Shirker. Your notion of no stress when driving is just not making sense. In the present times of living with the ever increasing pressures of life in general the stress is created by other people & events around us.

It is a categoric fact that the faster a motor vehicle or motor cycle or for that matter a cyclist is is being propelled the greater is the stress factor to the 'Pilot'.

 

First sentence - agreed, but that's what I said. Stress may be by external time factors but not caused by drivign at 80 rather than 70 itself.

 

Second sentence - don't believe it within the bounds of normal road use, i. e. excuding track driving. Human beings are just too different for that to be a categoric fact. Personally, I love driving and being on the road - my perfect holiday would be to just drive for 8 or 9 hours a day for a couple of weeks - be fantastic. As it is I do about 1000 miles or so a week and thankfully its a part of my job I enjoy a lot. It really isn't any more stressful to go at 80 than 70. If I want to go at 80 because time pressures are such that I am running tight and someone gets in my way then that can be stressful, but that's because of time and driving slower won't affect that one little bit. 95% of the time I get my timings right but every so often it inevitably goes wrong for one reason or another.

Edited October 3, 2011 by Shirker

[Champ]

 

 

Hi to you all out there. My GOD is this a pre-amble to the not so distant future?. We will all be effectively driving by wire and in principle be 'fastened to one'. The guy that gets his Shelby or other pre 2000's Pocket Rocket out for an Adrenaline Rush is going to be paying for all of this in a BIG WAY.

I have been using my 197,000 miles 97 V70 T5 CD Auto for the last few days,it is all far to easy to be a VERY,VERY naughty little boy again.

My 2000 2. 4T is no slug,but the T5 is an Orgasm on Tyres.

 

.

It's all relative, I could certainly call your T5 a slug against my Corvette I just sold.

Not disputing the T5 may be quick, but if you really want Orgasm on tyres, then you really want the C6 'vette, sub 4 seconds to 60,

 

Graham

[AWanderingLancastrian]

 

.

It's all relative, I could certainly call your T5 a slug against my Corvette I just sold.

Not disputing the T5 may be quick, but if you really want Orgasm on tyres, then you really want the C6 'vette, sub 4 seconds to 60,

 

Graham

 

Hi Champ. I get mine from a 2. 319cc straight 5cyl High Pressure turbo engine that returns 19/33mpg with a 4spd Auto box. Oh, the 19mpg is hauling a 26ft 1. 600 tonne Twin Axle caravan. The rest of the time is is between 23 & 33mpg.

My little comparative watch engine has not been chipped/re-mapped.

Now my old 1978 Mk2 3litre V6 Essex Auto Capri with 3spd Borg-Warner transmission was no slug either for that matter.

[mdbs]

Hi,

Others may travel at slower speed because they are more responsible, and able, drivers who can perceive danger before others know it exists. any rise in the speed limit will not necessarily mean a rise in my speed while towing or solo yet I am trained to drive fast in all conditions and roads. So I wouldn't say that I will be driving slower because of lack of ability, in fact quite the reverse.

 

As far as raising the limits go I'm in two minds as there will certainly be less time to react to a given situation when travelling 10mph faster and the potential consequences greater. I can't help but wonder why they haven't considered all speed limits in this consultation?

Regards,

Ian.

 

Notice I didnt name anyone in particular because I dont know them, as you dont know me, but IF you are trained to drive as you claim you will know how poor most drivers are.

 

Are you a Police man? Then you will also have people at work who cant drive well either.

 

But you are correct in saying that the better driver is sometimes the slower driver.

Who on this forum would pass the driving test again? Not many I would say. Even as hopeless as it is.

[AWanderingLancastrian]

Hi,

Others may travel at slower speed because they are more responsible, and able, drivers who can perceive danger before others know it exists. any rise in the speed limit will not necessarily mean a rise in my speed while towing or solo yet I am trained to drive fast in all conditions and roads. So I wouldn't say that I will be driving slower because of lack of ability, in fact quite the reverse.

 

As far as raising the limits go I'm in two minds as there will certainly be less time to react to a given situation when travelling 10mph faster and the potential consequences greater. I can't help but wonder why they haven't considered all speed limits in this consultation?

Regards,

Ian.

 

 

Hi Ian. I like at least one other following this topic but I am sure others have ponded in the past,are you also like one other on the forum a serving Traffic Officer or perhaps a member of a Firearms Rapid Response Team. There again you may be a serving Rapid Response Medic or an Advanced Driving Instructor. Which ever you are you are always at the mercy of the unexpected however vigilante and well trained you are.

Reading the road is a skill that is perfected with the variations of terrain,location & years of mileage. The kids of today want to run before they have shed the short trousers and gym-slips. They are among the biggest single group that should be speed restricted but policing it would be as inconsistent as the legislation on cigarettes & booze.

The issue of a proposed increase in the National Speed Limit on Motorways from 70mph to 80mph in my opinion is not such a big deal.

There have been mountains of newsprint to name but one format churned out about this issue.

Correct me if I am wrong but when I passed my Ministry of Transport Driving Test on the 10th April1964 at 3pm at the Bootle Test Centre,Liverpool there was no speed limit on the 'Open Road', I am referring to the use of private motor cars only.

Then in December of 1965 the 70mph limit was introduced for motor cars,car derived vans (up-to 2tonnes) and other defined motor vehicles. Then on the 15th December 1974 there was a blanket 50mph on Motorways,Trunk routes and 'A' roads.

The majority of cars and light vans are driving at 80ish mph anyway.

I believe that legally upping the speed limit would help reduce/prevent bunching and very likely also reduce the central lanes hogger albeit most of our motorways are three lane not four lane.

There could also be an enforced minimum in the extreme outside lane on sections that are clear & running freely with 80mph,overtake and move back when the slower moving lanes permit. Cameras & unmarked cars should be increased for surveillance and communication with policing units. The high speed hogger and the snails could be equally taken too task.

The reintroduction of a legally higher speed on Motorways will simply legitimise it and not necessarily bring about a tangible and provable increase in RTA's. The modern motor car and motorcycle (certainly over the latter 15yrs) is well capable of the speeds that are already being practised. Yes it is all very subjective and very vehicle/driver focused; then hasn't that always been the case?.

The only downside to modern cheap performance cars is the Clever Dick,Know All youngsters with more money than experience or parents that have excessive money and brains equal in size to their speed crazy two finger wagging offspring.

Accidents don't happen,they are caused. Driving without due care & attention is possibly the case in most of the RTA's. Mechanical failure is most likely down to failure in maintaining service & repair schedules. CAUSE & EFFECT.

[Ern]

Admin Comment

 

Content removed

Edited October 10, 2011 by Grandpa Steve

[steve1052cc]

 

 

Hi Ian. I like at least one other following this topic but I am sure others have ponded in the past,are you also like one other on the forum a serving Traffic Officer or perhaps a member of a Firearms Rapid Response Team. There again you may be a serving Rapid Response Medic or an Advanced Driving Instructor. Which ever you are you are always at the mercy of the unexpected however vigilante and well trained you are.

Reading the road is a skill that is perfected with the variations of terrain,location & years of mileage. The kids of today want to run before they have shed the short trousers and gym-slips. They are among the biggest single group that should be speed restricted but policing it would be as inconsistent as the legislation on cigarettes & booze.

The issue of a proposed increase in the National Speed Limit on Motorways from 70mph to 80mph in my opinion is not such a big deal.

There have been mountains of newsprint to name but one format churned out about this issue.

Correct me if I am wrong but when I passed my Ministry of Transport Driving Test on the 10th April1964 at 3pm at the Bootle Test Centre,Liverpool there was no speed limit on the 'Open Road', I am referring to the use of private motor cars only.

Then in December of 1965 the 70mph limit was introduced for motor cars,car derived vans (up-to 2tonnes) and other defined motor vehicles. Then on the 15th December 1974 there was a blanket 50mph on Motorways,Trunk routes and 'A' roads.

The majority of cars and light vans are driving at 80ish mph anyway.

I believe that legally upping the speed limit would help reduce/prevent bunching and very likely also reduce the central lanes hogger albeit most of our motorways are three lane not four lane.

There could also be an enforced minimum in the extreme outside lane on sections that are clear & running freely with 80mph,overtake and move back when the slower moving lanes permit. Cameras & unmarked cars should be increased for surveillance and communication with policing units. The high speed hogger and the snails could be equally taken too task.

The reintroduction of a legally higher speed on Motorways will simply legitimise it and not necessarily bring about a tangible and provable increase in RTA's. The modern motor car and motorcycle (certainly over the latter 15yrs) is well capable of the speeds that are already being practised. Yes it is all very subjective and very vehicle/driver focused; then hasn't that always been the case?.

The only downside to modern cheap performance cars is the Clever Dick,Know All youngsters with more money than experience or parents that have excessive money and brains equal in size to their speed crazy two finger wagging offspring.

Accidents don't happen,they are caused. Driving without due care & attention is possibly the case in most of the RTA's. Mechanical failure is most likely down to failure in maintaining service & repair schedules. CAUSE & EFFECT.

 

 

Not all younsters are clever dick know it alls as not all older paople are doddering old fools. My son drives high performance cars, and he also builds and drives modified cars. He has a clean licence. and no accidents after 10years driving, and riding a high powed motorbikes. He also drives about 1000+ miles a week for his job. His modified car is completly road legal, and built to a standard required for the track, but he saves driving it at high speed for track days and santapod drag strip on which he does very well in run what you've brung days. Some of the worst driving i have seen is by people of an age that should know better, hogging the middle lane on motorways not keeping up with traffic on other roads causing other drivers to become frustrate and take chances they would not normaly take to overtake them,and failing to read road and traffic conditions.

[r1cbm]

Not sure it will make much difference, remember this is already happening. Only change is the legalities of the situation.

[AWanderingLancastrian]

Not all younsters are clever dick know it alls as not all older paople are doddering old fools. My son drives high performance cars, and he also builds and drives modified cars. He has a clean licence. and no accidents after 10years driving, and riding a high powed motorbikes. He also drives about 1000+ miles a week for his job. His modified car is completly road legal, and built to a standard required for the track, but he saves driving it at high speed for track days and santapod drag strip on which he does very well in run what you've brung days. Some of the worst driving i have seen is by people of an age that should know better, hogging the middle lane on motorways not keeping up with traffic on other roads causing other drivers to become frustrate and take chances they would not normaly take to overtake them,and failing to read road and traffic conditions.

 

Hi Steve. Yes of course you are right. Your son and others like him,not least of all my youngest brother (now 61yrs) are exceptions to those that want to take others prides & joys and run riot etc. I am using a broader and ever growing analogy. It is going to be more profound as the youngster job gap gets nearer to 1. 5million.

I have one living very close to me, I doubt at times whether indeed he actually did pass the driving test the day before the newly acquired car was taken out off the driveway. Uninsured and remodelled a stone wall on his impetuous journey.

[AWanderingLancastrian]

Not sure it will make much difference, remember this is already happening. Only change is the legalities of the situation.

 

 

Hi r1cbm. It may not have any tangible effect and if Politicians and Ministry of Transport bods have a hand in the research to prove that their case was justifiable anything is possible in the 'Name of Claims'.

The interesting thing about speed on Motorways and Trunk Routes is that for the most part it is Self Regulatory. That is to say as the volume of traffic increases it tends to proceed slower and also at a steadier speed.

I don't for one minute think that the legitimising of the increase from 70mph to 80mph is going to transform our motorways into race tracks any-more that at times they appear to be.

As I said in my post #84 it could/should serve to reduce a few of the problems of traffic flow,not least of all bunching.

Your observation has indeed mirrored/repeated what I had already said in the same post,#84.

[basilfawlty]

Reading about Chris Huhne in the guardian he's saying the libdem part of the coalition will only back the increase to 80mph if it applies to electric cars only :wacko: make of that what you will.

[AWanderingLancastrian]

Reading about Chris Huhne in the guardian he's saying the libdem part of the coalition will only back the increase to 80mph if it applies to electric cars only :wacko: make of that what you will.

 

Hi basilfawlty. I haven't seen that,but if that is the case it is tantamount to creating an Electric Lane for a minority in a similar way to the bus lanes. Why should electric cars be the only consideration for the proposal to increase from 70mph?.

I wonder if it is a subversive way of taking stock of the value of the investment into electric powered vehicles?.

[Woodie106]

there won't be a noticable difference on the A2 as you can normally only average 90/95