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Will My Picasso 2.0 Hdi Tow This Caravan


robbo7720
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Hi there,

help is needed i have a picasso 2003 2. 0 diesel hdi i am looking to purchase my first caravan which will be around 1250kgs fully laden . My Picasso will pull a maximum of 1300kgs. Picasso has 90bhp and 205nm i will tune the power up to 115bhp and nm to 265. My concern is that after purchasing the caravan that the car will fail to tow this weight . I do not have any friends with a caravan that i could test.

 

please give your opinion on this matter and please tell me if you have a picasso that will tow this weight with my pulling weight and car power.

 

my car will also have 5 persons in and boot full of gear.

 

regards in advanced

david

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Hi there,

help is needed i have a picasso 2003 2. 0 diesel hdi i am looking to purchase my first caravan which will be around 1250kgs fully laden . My Picasso will pull a maximum of 1300kgs. Picasso has 90bhp and 205nm i will tune the power up to 115bhp and nm to 265. My concern is that after purchasing the caravan that the car will fail to tow this weight . I do not have any friends with a caravan that i could test.

 

please give your opinion on this matter and please tell me if you have a picasso that will tow this weight with my pulling weight and car power.

 

my car will also have 5 persons in and boot full of gear.

 

regards in advanced

david

Hi Robbo

I have just used the cc web site to crunch your numbers,

 

 

kerbweight ratio is 96%

towing limit ratio 96%

gross train weight 102%

nose weight ratio 109%

bhp per ton is 32

 

as you can see you are up against it at best

 

hope this is a help

 

pigs

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Hi David and welcome to Caravan Talk. :)

 

If you have not towed a caravan before the combination you propose could lead to an accident. Towing at 96% with a GTW of 102% is not recommended. Some members do tow at 96%+ but generally most of us don't. If your journeys were just on flat roads ie: Norfolk and Lincolnshire perhaps it would'nt be a problem but when you are faced with Motorways, a long incline plus a headwind and sidewinds-either from exposed land or HGV's you will have no margin of safety.

Either downsize your caravan or upgrade your car.

"my car will also have 5 persons in and boot full of gear". I would suggest you need to look for a vehicle with a minimum kerbweight of 1600kg which,if you follow the guideline (85% of kerbweight) will give you 1360kg as a safe towing ratio.

If you have any more questions or comments then come back and one of us should be able to answer them.

 

HTH.

 

Regards.

Col

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Hi David,

 

I've just copied these figures from the 2004 Picasso Technical Specification Brochure.

 

The figures are as follows:

 

2. 0 HDi

 

Unladen weight - 1300kg

Max laden weight - 1850kg

Max towing weight braked - 1300kg

(that gives a gross train weight of 3150kg (1850kg + 1300kg))

Max tow hitch download - 80kg

Max roof rack load - 80kg

 

Max power (hp/rpm) - 90/4000

Max torque (lb/rpm) - 151/1900

 

Max speed - 109

0-62 mph (secs) - 12. 6

 

Brakes (ABS) - Front Discs - Rear Drums

 

I towed my 1300kg caravan a couple of times with a 1. 8 16v Picasso. I had it weighed and with just me and fuel it was 1420kg (the brochure states 1245kg). I would suspect your Picasso weighs nearer 1475kg but you would need to confirm this on a weighbridge (That would leave 375kg for extra passengers and luggage).

When towing I had no problems with stability but the 1. 8 16v (117bhp and 120lb torque) struggled due to the high revs needed to access the power so I only did short local trips on roads that I knew.

You shouldn't have power issues if you get a remap but I do think you are leaving the margins very tight weight wise. Once you are fully loaded with five people and luggage you could be very close to or possibly over the Gross Train Weight. I would rather err on the side of caution and tow with a car that has a slightly heavier kerbweight and a higher towing limit. For example, I have a Vectra C 1. 9 CDTI. It has a kerbweight of approx 1570kg and a towing weight of 1600kgs. That gives a much better towing weight ratio for a 1250kg caravan and also means I would be well within the Gross Train Weight limit.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Regards,

 

Andy.

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Unladen weight - 1300kg

Max laden weight - 1850kg

Max towing weight braked - 1300kg

(that gives a gross train weight of 3150kg (1850kg + 1300kg))

 

I don't know the GTW of the car in question but it cannot be assumed that the GVW plus the manufacturer's tow limit will add up to the GTW. ..it could be considerably less. .

 

The GTW will be on the car's weight plate and that figure minus the GVW will be the maximum legal tow limit if the car is laden to the GVW although the manufacturer may set lower one based on the ability to restart on a gradient.

 

With many French cars the actual weight of the car, loaded and ready for the road, may reduce the tow limit below the manufacturer's stated maximum to keep within the plated GTW.

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Hi

 

We have just bought our first family caravan. We did have a caravan a good few years ago, but basically we are new to caravanning.

 

I looked at this topic and I have used the CC outfit match. The results we got were as follows.

Kerbweight Ratio 76%

  • tick.png1 Kerbweight ratio: 76%
  • The caravan's laden weight is within 85% of the car's kerb weight, and therefore meets Club guidelines.

Gross Train Weight 100%

  • tick.png1 Towing limit ratio: 100%
  • The caravan's laden weight is within the car's stated towing limit, and therefore meets legal limitations.

Towing Limit 100%

  • tick.png1 Gross train weight ratio: 100%
  • The sum of the car and caravan’s fully laden weights is within the car’s gross train weight. This outfit can therefore be used legally with both the car and the caravan fully laden.
  • tick.png1 Nose weight ratio: 121%
  • The car's nose weight should be fine to safely tow this caravan. If this figure is high, however, (typically over 100%) care will be needed to load the caravan so that the car’s nose weight limit is not exceeded, but this should be practically achievable. Aim for 5-7% of the caravan’s actual laden weight without overloading the car.

Nose Weight Ratio 121%

BHP Per Ton 39

  • warning.png BHP per ton : 39
  • The car's engine power is quite low to tow this caravan. It may be sluggish and uncomfortable on hills or at junctions.

  • The car we have is a KIA Carens 1 1. 6CRDI 5SEATS
  • The Caravan we have bought is a Adria Altea 542DK 1070KG 1300KG
  • Your feedback on this combination would be welcome. We will not be loading the caravan too much. It will basically be an Awning or a Porch Awning, Cutlery and Plates/Cups/Glasses (plastic),Waste and water barrels, some clothes. As we are new we wont have much else to take apart from food and drink which we will carry in the car.
  • We have been away last weekend, the towing conditions were bad last Friday with high winds and rain, but I felt the caravan towed well, I was able to stay in 6 th gear for most of the trip on the Dual Carriage, and when we did hit any hills that slowed us down it would only be to about 50mph. we also had a drive over the Glens from Stonehaven to Banchory, and I found again it was a pleasant drive and the tow was ok even when we hit some step hills. I appreciate that the Caravan was at nothing like its Max MTPLM.

Thanks John

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I had a neighbour who towed with a picasso same as yours. He towed an Elddis Mistral with it and although it seemed alright, I never did like the look of things when he set of. The feedback I got from him after was. It did seem to struggle a bit. BE CAREFUL if you do decide to go ahead, The people on the site know what they are talking about which is better than any figures you can quote.

If in doubt DONT DO IT. Regards Peter :(

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Hi

 

I know this might be a stupid question. The 85% that is mentioned that is the adviseable percentage to help keep your caravan as stable as possible. So am I right in my thoughts that is related to your kerbside weight.

 

I am now geting a bit confused, I did the CC test before I bought and apart from the BHP per ton everything else seem to come within the spec in relation to the car and caravan. Whats confusing me is that it seems that some people if I am correct saying you should only tow 85% of your cars Max Towing weight.

 

Could someone please clarify what the situation as I felt my match was maybe not ideal but it was a safe towing match (that was me basing my match figures of 76% kerbside).

 

What makes it more confusing. I have looked at our old car doing the CC outfit match, it was a Citroen C4 Picasso and it also has a max towing weight braked of 1300kg, but because it has a much lighter kerbside weight the % is over 85%.

 

Thanks

Edited by Woodyloon
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if I am correct saying you should only tow 85% of your cars Max Towing weight.

 

No.

85% of the car's KERBWEIGHT.

 

http://www. gocaravanning. com/cars/towcars. html

 

It is recommended that you do not exceed an 85% caravan to car weight ratio. This means that your caravan, fully loaded, should not be more than 85% of your cars kerb-weight (or max tow weight if this is lower). If you are an experienced caravaner you can go up to 100% weight ratio but this is not recommended. If the caravan is more than the kerb-weight of the car and you are stopped by the Police you could be prosecuted.

 

Caravan or Trailer /Towing Vehicle Weight Ratio

The actual laden weight of the caravan expressed as a percentage of the kerb weight of the towing vehicle, i. e: actual laden weight of caravan, divided by kerb weight of towing vehicle, multiplied by 100.

 

HTH

 

Regards.

Col

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  • 4 weeks later...

If the caravan is more than the kerb-weight of the car and you are stopped by the Police you could be prosecuted.

I assume you mean that if the caravan MPTLM is more than the unladen weight of the towing vehicle when towing on a B licence ?

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