Winter Diesel

[Lee E]

Hi All

 

Hope you can help here - just a query.

 

deisel changes in this country depending on the season (so im told). If i were to add a small bit of winter deisel to the tank in the summer time, would this result in less smoke and acleaner burn???? Or would it wreck the engine???

 

 

Regards

Lee

(ps Boy I miss Robjax's posts on this subject - RIP).

[RogerL]

I believe that winter diesel is formulated to prevent the waxing that would occur with summer diesel at low temperatures - so I guess the formulation would have little effect in summer, even if used at 100%.

[Wingco]

I believe the anti waxing ingredients in winter diesel constitute about 1. 5% non-combustible, which is one reason why fuel consumption is a little heavier in winter.

[ivan leslie]

Sorry for this - having driven for too many years, and had diesel cars for the past 15 or so of them, I have never heard of winter (or summer for that matter) deisel. for the non technical amongst us, is this thread a wind up now that we are getting fairly close to April 1st??

[RogerL]

Sorry for this - having driven for too many years, and had diesel cars for the past 15 or so of them, I have never heard of winter (or summer for that matter) deisel. for the non technical amongst us, is this thread a wind up now that we are getting fairly close to April 1st??

It's not a wind-up - the formulation for diesel is altered during the year by the refinery/distribution depot (not sure which) so that diesel at the pumps is suitable for the climatic conditions (temperature) - the ordinary motorist/HGV driver simply gets the correct fuel automatically.

 

It does mean that if you keep a can of diesel for emergencies, fill it during the winter, not the summer.

[thelonegroover]

Sorry for this - having driven for too many years, and had diesel cars for the past 15 or so of them, I have never heard of winter (or summer for that matter) deisel. for the non technical amongst us, is this thread a wind up now that we are getting fairly close to April 1st??

 

If anything summer diesel will block the filter due to waxing if used in very cold winters. I wouldn't have thought you would notice the difference in perfomance if you use winter diesel in summer.

[SilverSaloon]

dont worry about it. you can use winter diesel in the summer without any problems.

 

using summer diesel in winter may cause waxing but to be honest in the UK its hardly cold enough to make any huge difference.

[TedNewman]

Certainly not a 'wind-up' back in the Winter of 1962/3 before the general winterisation of diesel you would often come across guys with 'frozen' fuel and it was not uncommon to see lorries and buses parked up with paraffin heaters under their fuel tanks - at the time I was driving coaches for Grey Green in London and our workshops used put an additive into the tanks when they filled up the tanks - we had our own fuel pumps!

[RogerL]

Certainly not a 'wind-up' back in the Winter of 1962/3 before the general winterisation of diesel you would often come across guys with 'frozen' fuel and it was not uncommon to see lorries and buses parked up with paraffin heaters under their fuel tanks - at the time I was driving coaches for Grey Green in London and our workshops used put an additive into the tanks when they filled up the tanks - we had our own fuel pumps!

I remember! They used to light a little bonfire under the fuel tank to warm the diesel up - it appeared incredibly dangerous but since diesel doesn't vapourise like petrol it wasn't quite as bad as it seemed - those were the days before H&S and PC!

[ian dunning]

I remember! They used to light a little bonfire under the fuel tank to warm the diesel up - it appeared incredibly dangerous but since diesel doesn't vapourise like petrol it wasn't quite as bad as it seemed - those were the days before H&S and PC!

 

Hi Roger,

I agree as diesel is classified as a non volatile fuel,

Regards,

Ian.

[neil]

I remember! They used to light a little bonfire under the fuel tank to warm the diesel up - it appeared incredibly dangerous but since diesel doesn't vapourise like petrol it wasn't quite as bad as it seemed - those were the days before H&S and PC!

 

Hi RogerL

 

When I was an engineering apprentice in the dim dark past I still remember leaving the welding shop rather

quickly as I spotted one of the lads starting to weld the leaky diesel fuel tank on the company bedford lorry.

All 'the lads' laughed and tried to reassure me that it was perfectly safe as long as the tank was full - I still

went over to the other workshop for a drink - the tea machine was at least three stone walls away

 

neil

[thelonegroover]

Hi RogerL

 

When I was an engineering apprentice in the dim dark past I still remember leaving the welding shop rather

quickly as I spotted one of the lads starting to weld the leaky diesel fuel tank on the company bedford lorry.

All 'the lads' laughed and tried to reassure me that it was perfectly safe as long as the tank was full - I still

went over to the other workshop for a drink - the tea machine was at least three stone walls away

 

neil

 

Seems strange, but you’re probably safer tryingto weld a tank of diesel than going into a dusty flour store.

[ian dunning]

Seems strange, but you’re probably safer tryingto weld a tank of diesel than going into a dusty flour store.

Hi,

Very true, I was in a dust explosion in a large woodworking factory and it's not very pleasant. It singed my eyelashes together so I couldn't see a thing ,

Regards,

Ian.

[ivan leslie]

my memory is kicking in!! was this the reason people had those little paraffin heaters which were left lit under the car engine overnight in their garage? still, though, didn't know there was a different summer & winter fuel - great what you learn on here isn't it

[phil1041]

I can remember patrolling the upper reaches of the M62 in winter and rescuing lorry drivers who had abandoned their vehicles because the fuel lines had frozen, oh happy days!

 

Phil.

[MacSpot]

Certainly not a 'wind-up' back in the Winter of 1962/3 before the general winterisation of diesel you would often come across guys with 'frozen' fuel and it was not uncommon to see lorries and buses parked up with paraffin heaters under their fuel tanks - at the time I was driving coaches for Grey Green in London and our workshops used put an additive into the tanks when they filled up the tanks - we had our own fuel pumps!

 

Gosh this has brought back memories. My dad owned a milk round and he had a Bedford diesel van around then. We had a little paraffin heater, it looked a bit like a flat bottomed flying saucer, that was put under the engine while we had breakfast. Sadly in the winter of 1962/63 it didn't help much, the van broke down a couple of times because of frozen diesel. Stood around in the early hours waiting for the mechanic, somehow too the shine of plodding around in fresh snow.

 

The smell of paraffin still triggers the memories - I wish I could say happy, but ***** it was cold.

 

Alec

[beejay]

Most modern diesel engines have a heating system in the fuel line which automatically switches in at the pre-set temperature to prevent waxing in the filter. As excess fuel is returned to the tank this helps to warm the fuel in the tank which is why waxing is rarely a problem these days. Some early diesel engined cars required the key to be turned and held in a pre-start "heater" position until a light on the dash went out. I started with diesel cars back in 1983. First BX didn't have any fuel heater and Citroen sold an additive and I still have a tin. If you were wise you carried a spare fuel filter. .. Second BX had an electric element in the filter controlled by a thermostat. Third one had fuel line heated by water in the cooling system and accessory devices of this type used be available. I only suffered waxing once in this country, the fuel filter looks as if it is encased in a block of lard.

Winter diesel in the U. K. is treated with anti waxing agents for low temperatures, and in the continental alpine regions it can be treated for temperatures down to -20°, many filling stations having notices advertising the rating. . In the old days parafin used to be added up to 15% but strictly illegal as there is no duty on it and modern, common rail, very high pressure, fuel injection systems are susceptible to fuel quality.

[RogerL]

my memory is kicking in!! was this the reason people had those little paraffin heaters which were left lit under the car engine overnight in their garage? still, though, didn't know there was a different summer & winter fuel - great what you learn on here isn't it

I think that was something different - multigrade oils weren't available, at least not readily, and trying to start a cold engine full of 50 viscosity single grade oil was difficult, given that carburetor and choke mechanisms were crude in those days - the paraffin heater also stopped the engine freezing and splitting!

[Wingco]

Talking of memories and flat paraffin heaters, we always had one in the outside karzi.

[jan69c]

I used to put a gallon of petrol in with a tankful of diesel in my old Ford Transit, that worked a treat. In the army friends of mine used to put 15% petrol in with the diesel in Norway, never had any trouble with waxing.

[Guest Surfer]

Just use vegetable oil, no problem except in winter!

[Artleknock]

I used to have an "L" reg ford mondeo and in the handbook it said that if winter diesel was unavailable it was permissible to add 30% kerosene (home heating oil).

But of course no one would do that because there is no fuel duty paid on it

[Guest Rimmer]

I used to put a gallon of petrol in with a tankful of diesel in my old Ford Transit, that worked a treat. In the army friends of mine used to put 15% petrol in with the diesel in Norway, never had any trouble with waxing.

 

When I worked at a service stations garage on the M1, leicester Forest East as a forecourt supervisor, I know there were certain vehicles that used to run 90% deisel and 10% petrol. It's amazing what the HM forces could get away with! Plus a famous pie company ran their lorries like it too!

[SilverSaloon]

When I worked at a service stations garage on the M1, leicester Forest East as a forecourt supervisor, I know there were certain vehicles that used to run 90% deisel and 10% petrol. It's amazing what the HM forces could get away with! Plus a famous pie company ran their lorries like it too!

 

yep, i currently put in about 7 litres of petrol to 1 full tank of vegetable oil into my E300D

[GeorgeB]

further to all the replies so far, just to expand it that little bit further, northern Euroean countries also have winter & summer grade petrol as well as winter & summer grade diesel!