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Help for a newbie re bottles


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Morning,

 

We are debating waiting until next year to get the van due to prices and availability . Meantime however we are going to go ahead with getting a Cadac for the garden as we can take it with us once we get the van.

 

Just to confirm what I think regarding gas bottles.

 

Butane bottle come filled and you just exchange empty for full . Propane you buy the bottle and take it to get filled ?

 

if this is right which is the cheaper in the long run option. ?

 

also what size of bottles do you take in the van and type . Hoping the bottle we get for the cadac can be used for the van to. Have read though that using either longer tubing to take the BBQ away from the van when using the BBQ point is the right thing, or using a bottle away from the van

 

thanks 

 

 

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Go for Propane rather than Butane as it guards against cold weather problems. Both Propane and Butane standard bottles are used on an exchange basis i.e. you exchange your empty bottle for a replacement full one. Best solution is to get a refillable Propane bottle such as Safefill (there are other makes). The bottle is expensive to purchase in the first place but then you just refill it yourself at LPG outlets (e.g. Morrisons garages). Buying gas in this way is much much cheaper than exchanging standard bottles. The other big advantage of a re-fillable is you don't have to wait until the bottle is properly empty - you can top it up any time. With a standard bottle you have to wait until it is fully empty before you exchange otherwise you are throwing gas away which makes it even more expensive. Because of this people tend to use two bottles so they are not caught without any gas.

I use a single 7.5kg Safefill bottle and top it up whenever convenient.

Life is not a rehearsal . . .:)

Porsche Cayenne S Diesel & Knaus StarClass 695. Previously Audi S4 Avant & Elddis Super Sirocco

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There are two types of gas in UK, butane and propane. 
butane comes in blue bottles, propane in red bottles. 
Both types are exchange type I.E. when it runs out, you exchange the empty for a full one. 
There are two main suppliers of bottled gas, Calor and Flogas, with Calor being the biggest name. 
You can also get refillable systems, that use LPG from petrol stations and specialists suppliers 

Most caravans use propane, because it works at low temperature, whereas butane stops working below around 5 degrees 

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brillant , thanks so much for the speedy responses.

 

Intend to caravan in the winter time so Propane it is 

 

thanks again

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To save the initial outlay on purchasing the bottles to start with,I bought both of my (empty) bottles on Ebay,then just had to pay to exchange them for 2 full ones.

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4 minutes ago, George&Ade said:

To save the initial outlay on purchasing the bottles to start with,I bought both of my (empty) bottles on Ebay,then just had to pay to exchange them for 2 full ones.

 

awww thats interesting thanks

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32 minutes ago, KnausCol said:

 Best solution is to get a refillable Propane bottle such as Safefill (there are other makes).


That is a sweeping statement that is not applicable to everyone.

 

It depends on usage which is also dependent on your caravanning choices with regards to sites, i.e. with or without electric.

 

We always use CMC sites with electricity, so my 10Kg BP light will last me 3 years, so there is no way a Safefill is the best option for me.

Jaguar E-Pace 180D HSE R Dynamic - 2008 Swift Conqueror 540

 

"Unless otherwise stated, my posts will be my personal thoughts and have the same standing as any other member of Caravan Talk"

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5 minutes ago, Grandpa Steve said:


That is a sweeping statement that is not applicable to everyone.

 

It depends on usage which is also dependent on your caravanning choices with regards to sites, i.e. with or without electric.

 

We always use CMC sites with electricity, so my 10Kg BP light will last me 3 years, so there is no way a Safefill is the best option for me.

 

 

can I ask what a BP light is , is that butane ? whats the lite ?

 

thanks 

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1 minute ago, angie2020 said:

 

 

can I ask what a BP light is , is that butane ? whats the lite ?

 

thanks 


The “lite” refers to it being a composite cylinder as opposed to the standard steel ones.

https://www.flogas.co.uk/gaslight

Jaguar E-Pace 180D HSE R Dynamic - 2008 Swift Conqueror 540

 

"Unless otherwise stated, my posts will be my personal thoughts and have the same standing as any other member of Caravan Talk"

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35 minutes ago, George&Ade said:

To save the initial outlay on purchasing the bottles to start with,I bought both of my (empty) bottles on Ebay,then just had to pay to exchange them for 2 full ones.

If they are Calor bottles that is actually illegal! Calor never sell bottles, they are only ever rented and remain Th property of Calor with only the original renter having the right to use them.

This is often ignored though.

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2 minutes ago, Grandpa Steve said:


The “lite” refers to it being a composite cylinder as opposed to the standard steel ones.

https://www.flogas.co.uk/gaslight

 

thank you 

so if you are starting from scratch with nothing to exchange the charge for the bottle is not returned if you ever decide to return the empty bottle with no refill 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, angie2020 said:

 

thank you 

so if you are starting from scratch with nothing to exchange the charge for the bottle is not returned if you ever decide to return the empty bottle with no refill 

 

 

If they are Calor bottles you get a partial refund if you return them in the first few years. Or later you can get a small fee back if you return them to a depot rather than a dealer.

Other brands operate different systems.

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Be very careful about going for a safefill bottle! Lots of garages have or are removing the LPG pumps.

2019 Bailey Platinum (640) Phoenix from Chipping Sodbury caravans, towed by our  2017 my Discovery Sport!

 

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I agree with you Stevan.

My local garage has been "ignoring"this for a good 8 years now.😉

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Bloke I know ;) has never paid for a Calor cylinder and has 5 propane of various sizes.

Stay safe - Griff.  :ph34r:

Wheels at the front - Discovery 4. Wheels at the back - Bessacarr 845.

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56 minutes ago, Grandpa Steve said:


That is a sweeping statement that is not applicable to everyone.

 

It depends on usage which is also dependent on your caravanning choices with regards to sites, i.e. with or without electric.

 

We always use CMC sites with electricity, so my 10Kg BP light will last me 3 years, so there is no way a Safefill is the best option for me.

It wasn't a sweeping statement. My advice wasn't intended for everyone, it was a response to the OP who stated her intention to use her gas bottle both in a van when she gets one and for Cadac cooking when at home. As far as I recall the Cadac uses gas so electricity not an option :). If you are going to use sufficient gas a refillable makes very good economic sense. If not, I agree you won't get a return on the initial investment.

Life is not a rehearsal . . .:)

Porsche Cayenne S Diesel & Knaus StarClass 695. Previously Audi S4 Avant & Elddis Super Sirocco

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Another advantage of the Safefill is that they weigh about half as much as a steel Calor cylinder - if noseweight / payload is an issue with the caravan you eventually get, plus you can see how much gas is in them. Yes, Gaslight will give you that as well, but they're not cheap either (although cheaper than Safefill) and I don't know what a refill / exchange costs - but when I top my 7.5kg Safefill up, it's less than £7.

VW Touareg Escape towing a 2018 Knaus Starclass 695

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2 hours ago, KnausCol said:

Go for Propane rather than Butane as it guards against cold weather problems. Both Propane and Butane standard bottles are used on an exchange basis i.e. you exchange your empty bottle for a replacement full one. Best solution is to get a refillable Propane bottle such as Safefill (there are other makes). The bottle is expensive to purchase in the first place but then you just refill it yourself at LPG outlets (e.g. Morrisons garages). Buying gas in this way is much much cheaper than exchanging standard bottles. The other big advantage of a re-fillable is you don't have to wait until the bottle is properly empty - you can top it up any time. With a standard bottle you have to wait until it is fully empty before you exchange otherwise you are throwing gas away which makes it even more expensive. Because of this people tend to use two bottles so they are not caught without any gas.

I use a single 7.5kg Safefill bottle and top it up whenever convenient.

As I use EHUs I would never consider a refillable. I carry two 3.9kg botles and in normal times use about 6kg a year. Savings on refills would never be recouped by me over he reaining years left to me I suspect and prefer to get excange on site without faffing about

Alan

 

2005 Nissan X-trail 4WD diesel and Swift Charisma 540 2012 Lunar Clubman ES  2018 Lunar Clubman ES

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As we also only use EHU's, I have a pair of 3.9kg propane's which also help with getting our noseweight up.

 

Once the one in use expires, over to the second and get the empty replaced, usually at home where I use a local builders merchant, about the cheapest I have found.

Stay safe - Griff.  :ph34r:

Wheels at the front - Discovery 4. Wheels at the back - Bessacarr 845.

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4 hours ago, angie2020 said:

 

 

also what size of bottles do you take in the van and type . Hoping the bottle we get for the cadac can be used for the van to. Have read though that using either longer tubing to take the BBQ away from the van when using the BBQ point is the right thing, or using a bottle away from the van

 

thanks 

 

 

Most folk will use 6kg propane. We have a gas BBQ point on our van, which is a godsend as you soon get fed up of humping gas bottles in and out of the storage locker.

 

in our previous van we had two bottles, but these are heavy, so now we stick with one bottle and we have a lightweight electric hot plate for if we run out mid bbq.

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When I ran motorhomes I always had a refillable system as a lot of the time we would not be in EHU, so refillable made excellent financial sense, plus I could top up almost anywhere, especially in France.

 

Since changing to a caravan I have just used exchange cylinders. The main reason for doing so is that with a caravan (unlike a MH) I am almost invariably connected to EHU, so use that for water and space heating. In addition I have a microwave, a single electric hotplate on the cooker and (most useful of all) a single plate induction hob. As a result my gas usage is really minimal and is basically just used for the Cadac! On our last long trip of 7 weeks we used just under half if a 6kg Calor Lite. With such low usage a refillable system would be a waste of money.

 

However if I was going to spend a lot of time off grid then I would consider a refillable system, but the number of locations where you can refill your own cylinder is continually reducing due to the ongoing reduction in the number of LPG powered cars, and that’s going to continue, so it could be that in a few years time a refillable cylinder becomes unviable. Not every Morrison’s site has an LPG outlet (none within 50 miles of my home) 

 

So a lot to consider before investing the £160 in a refillable cylinder and how long it would take to recoup the cost. All down to usage really., 

Experience is something you acquire after you have an urgent need for it.

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Hi, so far as gas type then definitely propane.

So far as cylinder, well that's a more complicated choice and down to personal circumstances.

 

We changed to Gaslight, lightweight, cylinders when we bought a van with a high noseweight and have stuck with them since. We used a local guy and he was very reasonable but a couple of years back sold his business to Flogas.

 

First 10 kg exchange was just under £30 but last year the price was up to £45, but i did find B&M were a little cheaper so got it there.

The cheapest suitable cylinders now appear to be steel 11 kg propane, usually red but some 'leisure cylinders' are green, at £33.

 

As others have said, so far as refillable, it all depends how much gas you use. The difference in price between filling a 10 kg Safefill and a cylinder exchange is a max of £33 so on my current use that would be 5-6 years to break even.

However, the biggest issue for me, and why I decided against Safefill, which is a very good idea, is the low, and diminishing, number of fill points. 

 

If you have refillable and a handy fill point that's great but otherwise its an expensive fad.

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Is there any difference between the BP Gaslight cylinders & the Safefill?

 

I assume the BP/Flogas take LPG in the same way that Safefill do?

 

I ask because I've just bought a 10kg Safefill & found a BP cylinder at a much lower price(:

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No, BP/ Flogas are not refillable.

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We have a 'Lght' ie fibre glass canister for the garden-as we used to camp and bought it for that-not now we caravan-but htey are really light and the bonus is they are clear and you can see the liquid gas level through the weave-Homebase sell them -but the outlay is expensive for the full bottle/ deposit on the container . Unless you are lugging it round a lot not worth the extra money.

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