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During the original lockdown, movement of caravans was off limits, police were stopping them on some roads.

This one's different.

I can't claim to have read  through the reams of advice, but get the impression it would still be OK to return our caravan to storage under the new November 4th rules.

Is anyone in a position to confirm or refute, please?

Common sense says it should be fine, I'll not  be interacting with anyone other than handing the clamp keys over to the site owner, in a suitably safe way, for him to tow my van into its spot. But common sense isn't always the same thing as regulations...

 

Thanks for any informed information,

Richard.

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Why is it that whatever is put in place to try and get the virus situation under control , some people go out of their way to find valid reasons NOT to comply. What is so difficult to understand

Odd, that in the scheme of things, some folk think that one person, moving a van from home ? to a storage site and then returning home, to comply with the ' essential' rules of his insurance company,

Quite right Silversurf, essential journey or not the risk is zero. If You can still collect a brand new car from a showroom, yes you can buy a new caravan and have it delivered home and yes you can he

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As long as you are not going to stay in it and are just moving a relatively short distance to a secure compound I would not have thought there would be a problem, especially so if you have unattended access to do so - i.e. there will be no-one else there outside your bubble or household that needs to come within 2m of you. I would also suggest you carry something - such as your storage contract - to prove the point.

 

The definitive solution is to put in a call to the Inspector or Sergeant in the Traffic Dept at you local Constabulary. You will either get a clear answer or - if the travel is in the same county throughout - you may get the go-ahead to move it with their permission. 

 

Or ring the CMC?

 

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21 minutes ago, Brecon said:

All you need to know:  https://www.gov.uk/guidance/new-national-restrictions-from-5-november#travel

 

Having looked through, nowhere does it say it is OK to tow a caravan anywhere !!!!!!

Thanks for this.

OK, it prohibits  staying in a caravan, but does not prohibit towing one for other purposes. Hmm...

4 minutes ago, Woodentop said:

  Or ring the CMC?

   

That I'll try, yes.

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Do you regard this as essential travel? 

 

If you do, then you're sorted. 

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Graham

 

Unless otherwise stated all posts are my personal opinion 

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Why is it that whatever is put in place to try and get the virus situation under control , some people go out of their way to find valid reasons NOT to comply.

What is so difficult to understand "Stay At Home"? apart from ESSENTIAL purposes.!!!

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Ours was stuck on the drive for last lockdown. Council wanted it moved to storage, Police said no. So it stayed on our drive! I let them argue it out! Caravans are only allowed on our property for 28 days a year, unless they are behind the building line! Our council gets quite stroppy about it!

We just caused parking congestion with three extra cars on the road!

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1 hour ago, Brecon said:

Why is it that whatever is put in place to try and get the virus situation under control , some people go out of their way to find valid reasons NOT to comply.

What is so difficult to understand "Stay At Home"? apart from ESSENTIAL purposes.!!!

 

Odd, that in the scheme of things, some folk think that one person, moving a van from home ? to a storage site and then returning home, to comply with the ' essential' rules of his insurance company, with no contact whatsoever with any other person, totally complying with social distancing, hygiene and the rules of the storage site, are classed as a pariah, yet at the same time this weekend and beyond there will be thousands, possibly tens of thousands or more of Covidiots out and about to celebrate Nov 5th, no social distancing, no masks, no hygiene, no sense.

 

They won't stay at home, the Nov 5th celebrations will be an essential purpose to them as an excuse.

 

THIS AND OTHER EXAMPLES OF NON COMPLIANCE OF SOCIAL DISTANCING, HYGIENE ETC.  OF WHICH THERE WILL BE MANY, WILL BE THE REASON WHY COVID MAY NOT BE KEPT IN CHECK, NOT THAT JOE PUBLIC, METICULOUSLY COMPLYING WITH ALL HYGIENE AND CONTACT  RULES IN MOVING HIS VAN WITHOUT ANY CONTACT WILL BE A SOURCE OF INFECTION, IT WON'T.

 

Common sense should prevail , but....................

 

So who is the greater threat to society, certainly not Richard-Y , who if he complies with the above, can not pass on Covid if he had it, or catch Covid from anyone who has it because there was never any contact.

 

The

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Common sense isn't a gift, it's a punishment because you have to deal with everyone who doesn't have it.  :rolleyes:

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Quite right Silversurf, essential journey or not the risk is zero. If You can still collect a brand new car from a showroom, yes you can buy a new caravan and have it delivered home and yes you can he can move his. What galls me is I cannot see my mum but she can still have her cleaner in ? Check the rules it really isn't as simple as stay at home it is rediculously complex. Oh and my wife can be in a classroom of 30every day.And they are 11-18. Personally if they are going to get that stupid strict I am off to live in Russia or China.

8 hours ago, Brecon said:

 

 

7 hours ago, Brecon said:

Why is it that whatever is put in place to try and get the virus situation under control , some people go out of their way to find valid reasons NOT to comply.

What is so difficult to understand "Stay At Home"? apart from ESSENTIAL purposes.!!!

Because we are supposed to be a free country and some people are intelligent. They see no reason to follow every rule like sheep (dangerous and can result in some seriously nasty events ww2) but question and apply their own common sense . Every bit of common sense says moving the caravan is fine and far safer than going to my local take away which I am doing tonight to help keep them in business. (legally) Instead of police arresting 93year olds being taken home by a family they should be sorting the covidiots on the streets hugging drinking and shopping without masks etc. Had they been strict about the tier s this may not have happened and wasn't needed where we live anyway. Royally fed up. Oh and while moaning how can walking round a field with holes in it hitting a ball be banned whereas walking round it without is not. 

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I am afraid we are no longer a free country as many news items will testify. If somebody had told you last year that you could get arrested in England for going out in your caravan or meeting friends and family in your own home you would say they were insane but look at us now and they haven't finished yet.  

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2 hours ago, Jezzerb said:

Quite right Silversurf, essential journey or not the risk is zero. If You can still collect a brand new car from a showroom, yes you can buy a new caravan and have it delivered home and yes you can he can move his. What galls me is I cannot see my mum but she can still have her cleaner in ? Check the rules it really isn't as simple as stay at home it is rediculously complex. Oh and my wife can be in a classroom of 30every day.And they are 11-18. Personally if they are going to get that stupid strict I am off to live in Russia or China.

 

Because we are supposed to be a free country and some people are intelligent. They see no reason to follow every rule like sheep (dangerous and can result in some seriously nasty events ww2) but question and apply their own common sense . Every bit of common sense says moving the caravan is fine and far safer than going to my local take away which I am doing tonight to help keep them in business. (legally) Instead of police arresting 93year olds being taken home by a family they should be sorting the covidiots on the streets hugging drinking and shopping without masks etc. Had they been strict about the tier s this may not have happened and wasn't needed where we live anyway. Royally fed up. Oh and while moaning how can walking round a field with holes in it hitting a ball be banned whereas walking round it without is not. 

perhaps making different rules covering all types of sport is just too difficult and so they make a blanket rule.

I dont think you will be off to Russia or China any time soon, no flights :)

If the government are being strict, dont we the public, need to look at our own actions? As you say, hugging, drinking and shopping without masks.

 

macafee2

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12 hours ago, Richard_Y said:

 

I can't claim to have read  through the reams of advice, but get the impression it would still be OK to return our caravan to storage under the new November 4th rules.

 

As already said, call your local police helpline. That's what I did back in March the day after lockdown started when I got a call from the tracker people telling me that our caravan alarm had been triggered. The sergeant told me that it was OK to visit as an alarm had been triggered. He gave me his name and number in case I was stopped by the police on the way. Don't rely on "advice" from a load of strangers on a caravan website, the courts won't accept that as evidence or qualified advice will they?

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Or simply do what YOU think is right based on the guidelines you see.  As has been stated, the proposal is far safer than the activities of a good many that took place yesterday, are taking place today and will take place tomorrow.  While advice given on here is always given with the best of intentions, it is usually given based on an opinion and interpretation.  Even the police will have to apply a certain amount of interpretation to the guidelines as they are not specific to every single eventuality.

 

If you need to travel a considerable distance then some clarification from the police (as per Townie's comments) would perhaps be useful, but if it's only a few miles then I would simply just do it.

 

I am still working and the activities of individuals at various companies and individuals simply away from their front door poses a more significant risk than moving a caravan.

 

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Thanks all. I had no intention of stirring any hornets' nests here:  I might have known better! :)  


To reassure those worried about me thoughtlessly flouting rules,  I'd like explain that we're both over 65, my wife has a couple of health issues, and we both intend to protect ourselves, and respect protecting others if, unbeknown to us, we have contacted someone with the virus.

 

Including handing the keys over, outside, on an well ventilated ex-aerodrome, I'll be making less human contact during this 30 mile round trip than I just have in going for the essential weekly shopping trip, mask in place, and careful use of antibac, both of which I regard as important, and again, there'll be less contact than during moments of the essential job of replacing our entire heating system before it went horribly wrong, which meant the plumber & his apprentice taking our house over, while we lived in the caravan on the drive, to stay out of their way.   Hence the need to return it.

 

The local police 101 line refers me to their website for all Covid related issues... which of course has more or less the same list of regulations as we already have here!

 

The CMC legal line has promised to phone back some time later today.

 

Meanwhile it's a most gloriously sunny day out there....

 

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3 hours ago, Richie43 said:

 If somebody had told you last year that you could get arrested in England for going out in your caravan or meeting friends and family in your own home you would say they were insane 

If somebody had told you a year ago that the World would be in a grip of a global pandemic, you would also have said they were insane, (and it's not finished yet either.)

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9 minutes ago, Townie said:

If somebody had told you a year ago that the World would be in a grip of a global pandemic, you would also have said they were insane.

Although, to be fair, there were plenty of scientists warning that one was likely sooner or later.  As a result of this, the gov't ran Exercise Cygnus in 2016 to see what would happen when an influenza type pandemic arrived.
If you're interested, you can read more at https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/03/28/exercise-cygnus-uncovered-pandemic-warnings-buried-government/

Synopsis; 'findings of Exercise Cygnus have never seen the light of day. A senior former government source with direct involvement in the exercise said they were deemed “too terrifying” to be revealed.'

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I agree that there has to be an element of common sense.  My own quandary arises from the fact that I am Power of Attorney for an elderly aunt who has been in hospital for some time but has just (in the last couple of weeks) been assessed as requiring full time residential nursing dementia care.   She had her own home in Hertfordshire and consequently will be self-funding (after the 12 weeks that are paid for by the local authority).   With little other assets the house needs to be sold urgently to fund the care (@ £1300 per week).   I live 2 1/2 hours drive away in the South East and she has no other family of friends in the area.  So it will be up to me to go and organise the house clearance, get an estate agent engaged etc.  I can obviously deal with most aspects of the sale remotely but the initial steps require my physical presence....and soon.  I have carefully read the Government guidance and consider that the rules on Domestic Travel for care purposes should apply.  I won't be consulting the local constabulary - they have far too much on their plate.

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When you do take it to the storage it will be perfectly obvious you have no intention of staying in it. You will not have your overnight stuff and the caravan will be minus things it needs to allow you to stay in it. In the unlikely event you did get stopped by the police I am sure they will let you on your way or advise against it and you will have to go back so nothing lost.

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28 minutes ago, Paul1957 said:

When you do take it to the storage it will be perfectly obvious you have no intention of staying in it. You will not have your overnight stuff and the caravan will be minus things it needs to allow you to stay in it. In the unlikely event you did get stopped by the police I am sure they will let you on your way or advise against it and you will have to go back so nothing lost.

That's my strong feeling, yes. And as Stockcroft said, the local constabulary already have too much on their plate, so hopefully even if I do get stopped, it'll be as you suggest here.

35 minutes ago, Stockcroft said:

I have carefully read the Government guidance and consider that the rules on Domestic Travel for care purposes should apply.  I won't be consulting the local constabulary - they have far too much on their plate.

 

What a lot of other stresses this whole thing has caused people to face - Stockcroft, I hope all goes as well as it can for you.

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Advice has just been issued in our industry by the British Marine Federation and have copied a couple of paragraphs from their guidance which is aimed at the leisure boating industry but their are some similarities, thought it may help:

 

Private individuals can use their boats for exercise and therefore deliver their vessel to a boatyard for maintenance or winterisation.  However, current DEFRA guidance does not allow the boat owner to visit their vessel  to conduct maintenance themselves.

 

Private individuals can use their boats for exercise and therefore deliver their vessel to a boatyard for maintenance or winterisation.

 

Areas of industry where workers cannot work from home can stay open with Covid-19 secure protocols in place. This allows boatyards to provide maintenance and winterisation services.

 

Brokerage and boat showrooms need to close to the public. The regulations specifically say ‘Showrooms and other premises, including outdoor areas, used for the sale or hire of caravans, boats or any vehicle which can be propelled by mechanical means, and car washes’ should close. The restrictions do not prevent such businesses from remaining open to respond to orders or order queries either through a website or otherwise by on-line communication, by telephone or by post.

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If the storage site is open I cannot see the problem. After all there has been a demo in London against lockdown (! With the brother of ex Labour leader prominent again!) Another £10k fine hopefully!

People packing some city centres for last pint or six, so its hardly a risk in my opinion!

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When I looked the other day there was a piece specifically in the legislation that said you are allowed to be out of visiting business that is open.

I take it your storage yard is a business and it is open.

You could argue the same for all the caravan service centres that are open, yet they are still open and want trade. 

At the end of the day it is down to our own interpretation, some will view for and against. I'd say of you do it, print a copy of the legislation and highlight what exemption you are using, then at least it shows you have thought of it. Then if you get stopped it shows some thought and you will be advised either way.

 

1 minute ago, Jiffy176 said:

When I looked the other day there was a piece specifically in the legislation that said you are allowed to be out of visiting business that is open.

I take it your storage yard is a business and it is open.

You could argue the same for all the caravan service centres that are open, yet they are still open and want trade. 

At the end of the day it is down to our own interpretation, some will view for and against. I'd say of you do it, print a copy of the legislation and highlight what exemption you are using, then at least it shows you have thought of it. Then if you get stopped it shows some thought and you will be advised either way.

 

Let's face it, you can go to a Garden Centre and that's hardly essential in November is it!

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I assume that the storage site is a business and by storing your van for a fee is providing you a service.

 

The fifth reason in the list highlighted by Brecon in the third post allows

 

to buy goods or services from premises that are open, including essential retail.

 

If the storage is open for business, then you are simply accessing the service you have bought.  You will also, no doubt, be complying with the condition in your insurance  where you have told them that you store it securely away from your home.

 

It is essential in so far as it could put you in a severe hardship if your caravan was stolen uninsured, and that would be detrimental to your mental health!

 

 

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All most reassuring.  So hopefully not just common sense on the side of such trips, if sensibly done, but words in official writing too.

No other official advice yet, but come Monday I'm all set to take it back.

Thank you all for these helpful comments.

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Our storage has emailed and repeating the information as per last lockdown, if access is required we need to provide details when. They are still open. I am in a position that will require returning the van to storage, once my axle has been returned from factory and re-fitted, It is then due to go to factory to have the boiler repaired under warranty (pre-booked) . I contacted the factory on Wednesday to see about moving the date but they have confirmed my Monday appointment still stands and they will be open to receive me. The van is empty of all items, so it is obvious to anyone it is not going to be used overnight. After repair, I will then return the van home put all items back into the van and take it back to storage. During the time at the factory I will be in my car on the car park. I do not have to meet anyone at the storage depot. 

Dont forget, those who are still away on campsites will also be returning home once their pre arranged holidays are over. They too will require access to storage facilities.  

 

My neighbour had his classic car shell collected by the repairer's yesterday (Thursday) who had also said they are continuing to work. This 2nd Lockdown is so different from the 1st. 

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