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Just ordered two new front tyres for the meriva. And I noticed that Kwik fit do a reinforced tyre. A quick Google seems to suggest that they can handle higher tyre pressure and so more weight. 

 

Which makes me wonder if i should change the rear tyres to reinforced ones when I get a folding camper next year. Or are standard tyres perfectly fine at the pressure and speeds used when towing?

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I am very well aware of weight transference under heavy braking (and could bore you with the maths);. I was involved in the forensic investigation, and reconstruction of serious and fatal road traffic

No need at all for anything other than standard tyres on the rear when towing.    Think about it, most cars have a tow hitch limit if 75-100kg, the weight of a single (albeit chunky) passeng

Personally I drive at speeds where under/oversteer is highly unlikely to happen !   If you get into a situation where either is likely to happen then you have failed spectacularly to assess

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I think the "reinforced" tyres may be for motorhomes and some vans. Standard tyres are usually ok for towing even for big caravans and you are not towing anything too big anyway.

Check the car handbook if you are still doubtful but you should be fine.

 

Used to tow ours with an Astra with no mods to the car at all.

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No need at all for anything other than standard tyres on the rear when towing. 

 

Think about it, most cars have a tow hitch limit if 75-100kg, the weight of a single (albeit chunky) passenger 

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Experience is an awful teacher who ends up sending you simply horrifying bills

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Kwikfit will tell you all sorts of things that aren't true in an effort to take your money. The guys in the shop are on bonus to increase their sales. I was once told by them that my rear shocks were leaking and needed to be replaced "Shall we do them now, while we have the car on the lift doing the job you asked us to do, Sir?"

Having had new ones fitted less than 2 weeks previously, I declined and took the car back to the garage that had fitted them. "Kwikfit told you that did they?" they said said straight away before I told them who had said it. There was nothing wrong with them!

 

Mr Plodd (above) is correct, Kwikfit are not.

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Reinforced or commercial tyres are used for higher load ratings and are often used on caravans.  The tow car should not need them as the loading on the car should not be significantly increased when towing and should never exceed the maximum axle loading that can be carried by the standard tyres.

 

A folding caravan will usually be quite light so you should neo need anything special to tow it.

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55 minutes ago, daveat92 said:

Kwikfit will tell you all sorts of things that aren't true in an effort to take your money. The guys in the shop are on bonus to increase their sales. I was once told by them that my rear shocks were leaking and needed to be replaced "Shall we do them now, while we have the car on the lift doing the job you asked us to do, Sir?"

Having had new ones fitted less than 2 weeks previously, I declined and took the car back to the garage that had fitted them. "Kwikfit told you that did they?" they said said straight away before I told them who had said it. There was nothing wrong with them!

 

Mr Plodd (above) is correct, Kwikfit are not.

Well to be fair to Kwik fit this wasn't a man at their garage. But on their website which just lists all tyres suitable for the car when you give in the details. 

 

I buy online and have them come to me to fit the tyres. Though it is the only thing I trust kwikfit to do.

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1 hour ago, daveat92 said:

Kwikfit will tell you all sorts of things that aren't true in an effort to take your money. The guys in the shop are on bonus to increase their sales. I was once told by them that my rear shocks were leaking and needed to be replaced "Shall we do them now, while we have the car on the lift doing the job you asked us to do, Sir?"

Having had new ones fitted less than 2 weeks previously, I declined and took the car back to the garage that had fitted them. "Kwikfit told you that did they?" they said said straight away before I told them who had said it. There was nothing wrong with them!

 

Mr Plodd (above) is correct, Kwikfit are not.

KwikFit told him nothing. OP just read it somewhere. Please read his posting. 

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Graham

 

Unless otherwise stated all posts are my personal opinion 

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Fit the tyres that are recommended by the vehicle manufacturer.

 

My car has XL /Reinforced tyres all round as that's what are fitted as standard.  But it's a much bigger heavier car than the Meriva. ;) 

 

What is needed is to follow the vehicle's handbook wrt tyre pressures when towing.  For mine they add an extra bit on top of the max load pressure from the door pillar when towing!

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I've looked at Michelin Cross Climate + tyres for my car. Asda tyres list the recommended size 97W for £143 and an XL 101W for £139. Not buying at the moment, but interested to see a cheaper price for the XL tyre. 

 

John.

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Reinforced tyres can be noisier than standard load.

 

I have to have Reinforced on my Fiat due to the weight. They are woefully noisy.

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3 hours ago, AlwynMike said:

Reinforced tyres can be noisier than standard load.

 

I have to have Reinforced on my Fiat due to the weight. They are woefully noisy.

Is the ride also a bit harsher due to the increased pressures ?

Defender 90  cruising along with a Coachman Laser 640/4.  :)

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It is recommended by tyre manufacturers that new tyres should be fitted to the rear

 

The tyre industry recommends fitting the new tyres onto the rear axle. This will provide greater grip to the rear axle and mitigate any potential oversteer condition or loss of vehicle stability on slippery surfaces.

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Personally I would much rather have the better tyres in the front wheels. They do all of the steering and the vast majority of the braking! 

 

I would far rather be in a position where I could steer/stop in as short a distance as possible rather than protect myself from  possible  oversteer which is usually, but not always, the result, of excess speed in a corner. I can control my speed on the approach to, and in, a corner. What I cannot control are the actions of others who might do something in front of me (stepping off the pavement or pulling out in front of me) So I want to be able to stop in the shortest possible distance, and tyres with plenty of tread are better at that (especially in the wet) 

 

 These days with ABS the chances of “losing” the rear end, should you need to brake in a bend,  is much reduced. 

 

I accept that this view is contrary to the tyre industry but I am happy with my way of thinking. 

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19 minutes ago, Mr Plodd said:

Personally I would much rather have the better tyres in the front wheels. They do all of the steering and the vast majority of the braking! 

 

I would far rather be in a position where I could steer/stop in as short a distance as possible rather than protect myself from  possible  oversteer which is usually, but not always, the result, of excess speed in a corner. I can control my speed on the approach to, and in, a corner. What I cannot control are the actions of others who might do something in front of me (stepping off the pavement or pulling out in front of me) So I want to be able to stop in the shortest possible distance, and tyres with plenty of tread are better at that (especially in the wet) 

 

 These days with ABS the chances of “losing” the rear end, should you need to brake in a bend,  is much reduced. 

 

I accept that this view is contrary to the tyre industry but I am happy with my way of thinking. 

 

 

Agree,

 

ESP/DSC will sort out the tendency for swapping ends and modern tyres loose a lot less performance when worn compared to tyres from a decade or more ago.

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1 hour ago, terve said:

It is recommended by tyre manufacturers that new tyres should be fitted to the rear

 

The tyre industry recommends fitting the new tyres onto the rear axle. This will provide greater grip to the rear axle and mitigate any potential oversteer condition or loss of vehicle stability on slippery surfaces.

And here I was running them bald. 😂

 

I change tyres in pairs when the tred gets low or they're punctured/damaged. 

 

 

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6 hours ago, Mr Plodd said:

Personally I would much rather have the better tyres in the front wheels. They do all of the steering and the vast majority of the braking! 

 

I would far rather be in a position where I could steer/stop in as short a distance as possible rather than protect myself from  possible  oversteer which is usually, but not always, the result, of excess speed in a corner. I can control my speed on the approach to, and in, a corner. What I cannot control are the actions of others who might do something in front of me (stepping off the pavement or pulling out in front of me) So I want to be able to stop in the shortest possible distance, and tyres with plenty of tread are better at that (especially in the wet) 

 

 These days with ABS the chances of “losing” the rear end, should you need to brake in a bend,  is much reduced. 

 

I accept that this view is contrary to the tyre industry but I am happy with my way of thinking. 

 

Why go against the advice of those who have all road users safety in mind.

 

I think the tyre industry, with their extensive testing know best and explain why.

 

At a guess, it may not appear logical, but there are safety reasons, very well researched, tested  and agreed by all tyre manufacturers, I wonder why !

 

See here https://kumhotyre.co.uk/kumho-news/should-you-fit-new-tyres-to-the-front-or-rear/

 

Here  https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=52

 

And here http://www.btmauk.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Replacing-car-tyres-important-information.pdf

 

After reading these you will understand that when you say ....................and tyres with plenty of tread are better at that (especially in the wet) ........................ you will then understand that due to weight transference front to rear on braking and the rear axle loading consequently being reduced the tyres with plenty of tread need to be on the back for stability !

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6 hours ago, Silversurf said:

 

After reading these you will understand that when you say ....................and tyres with plenty of tread are better at that (especially in the wet) ........................ you will then understand that due to weight transference front to rear on braking and the rear axle loading consequently being reduced the tyres with plenty of tread need to be on the back for stability !

 

I am very well aware of weight transference under heavy braking (and could bore you with the maths);. I was involved in the forensic investigation, and reconstruction of serious and fatal road traffic collisions for many years. That reconstruction work was often questioned, at length, by barristers at Crown Court hearings and Coroners courts. So I feel fairly well qualified to comment on the subject.

 

 Modern vehicles all have brake limiting valves to reduce (sometime to virtually nothing) the braking effect applied by the rear wheels under heavy braking. Along with ABS and the such like it is virtually impossible to lock the rear wheels of a car under heavy braking even without ABS, unless you are half way round a bend and already nearing the grip limit of the rear tyres and then apply severe  braking. That’s a scenario that can happen but a child  running out in front of you on the straight is, in my view, much more likely

With the rear tyres being “unloaded” so therefore having very little effect on reducing the vehicles speed (think how effective a push bike or motorbikes back brake is compared to the front brake,) I am more than happy with having the better tyres  on the front to give me the very best possible grip where all of the steering at the vast majority of the braking is achieved. (How often have you needed to replace the rear brakes on your car compared to how often the fronts have been replaced ? That’s because the rear brakes are hardly ever used) 

 

Personal choice of course and I fully accept others may choose to adopt a different viewpoint. I have merely tried to explain the reasoning behind my preferred option  for others to consider and make their own decision on.  

 

 

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Agree with you 100% Andy.  Back in the 60s I spent a lot of my weekends thrashing through the forests of Wales & Scotland in fast rally cars.

 

If asked whether the best tyres should be on the front or the rear, all of them would opt for the front.

 

The theory being that providing a driver could get the front of his rally car around a bend, then surely the back would somehow have to follow?    :)

 

I have to admit that on the odd occasion, both tyres on the same side of my car would get round the corner first, but that was rare.

 

One dark night in Wales I sailed too fast round a bend and through a wide open (luckily) field gate completely sideways in my Mini Cooper 'S' without touching either gate post.  Some days later whilst in the area, I stopped and measured the gap between the posts, - the gap was just 7 inches longer than the length of the car!

 

Oh the crazy days of my youth!

 

Vin Blanc

 

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On 19/10/2020 at 08:54, John19 said:

I've looked at Michelin Cross Climate + tyres for my car. Asda tyres list the recommended size 97W for £143 and an XL 101W for £139. Not buying at the moment, but interested to see a cheaper price for the XL tyre. 

 

John.

 

Honest John, the Telegraph motoring guru highly recommends the Cross Climates.

 

For the OP's question, I think you need to be careful on mixing tyres as the TPS may be affected. I always replace like for like on my cars, so always have the same,  front and rear.

 

Regarding the debate on front and rear, am I right in thinking BMW saloons are still rear wheel drive?

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18 minutes ago, Vin Blanc said:

Agree with you 100% Andy.  Back in the 60s I spent a lot of my weekends thrashing through the forests of Wales & Scotland in fast rally cars.

 

If asked whether the best tyres should be on the front or the rear, all of them would opt for the front.

 

The theory being that providing a driver could get the front of his rally car around a bend, then surely the back would somehow have to follow?    :)

 

I have to admit that on the odd occasion, both tyres on the same side of my car would get round the corner first, but that was rare.

 

One dark night in Wales I sailed too fast round a bend and through a wide open (luckily) field gate completely sideways in my Mini Cooper 'S' without touching either gate post.  Some days later whilst in the area, I stopped and measured the gap between the posts, - the gap was just 7 inches longer than the length of the car!

 

Oh the crazy days of my youth!

 

Vin Blanc

 

For a skilled and trained driver the better tyres on the front probably does result in more control. However for a typical driver it is safer to understeer off the road than to leave it sideways or backwards! In an understeer  circumstance there is a reasonable prospect of regaining control after some speed is scrubbed off, but once the car is facing the wrong way recovery is very unlikely.

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7 minutes ago, Stevan said:

 In an understeer  circumstance there is a reasonable prospect of regaining control after some speed is scrubbed off, but once the car is facing the wrong way recovery is very unlikely.

 

With the better tyres on the front there is LESS chance of understeering in the first place though is there not??,

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How about a compromise, if only 2 new tyres are being bought, put one on the front and one on the back and then everyone is happy :D. A couple of weeks ago I replaced all 4 tyres on our car, they had all worn about the same so did not need to worry front or back. Our daughter had to replace the front tyres on her car recently and put them on the front since the rear ones had not worn that much and within a year all 4 will be worn similarly. In this case the only benefit of putting new on the back would be so the older tyres wear out and get replaced sooner.

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I always put any new tyres on the rear, and transfer the old rears to the front, that way they all get equal use, otherwise for a low mileage car the rears are in danger of age cracking before they wear out.

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Not too sure about  rear brakes not wearing out as often as the fronts. Admittedly with front discs and rear drums on a FWD vehicle, the rears seemed to last for ever. But with discs all round, the rears don't seem to last much longer than the fronts. Last few times I've done them on our vehicles, I've changed them all,pads and discs, while I've got the tools out,and in the mood. Regarding ESP and DSC, the OP talks of a Meriva, which is very much from the GM back catalogue, so I'm not too sure whether it would have such delights. Could be wrong on that one though. 

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