Jump to content

Confusion about noseweight


Recommended Posts

16 minutes ago, halifaxdan said:

As far as I can tell the “limit” is the towbar manufacturer.

Nope that is typically the vehicle manufacturer (but can be reduced by other factors/items in the equation as you state).

 

My first Galaxy (09 plate) I hawked around the local towbar fitters to find any that permitted the then current Ford nose weight allowance of 90kg.  Many were still only rated at the previous Ford figure of 80kg.  

 

The Bosal bar fitted to my vehicle had a limit of 100kg on its rating plate and instruction book.  I was - of course - limited by the Ford handbook's 90kg.

2012 Bailey Pegasus 2 Rimini towed by 2019 Ford Galaxy Titanium X, 2.0 EcoBlue, 8 speed auto.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 75
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

Most people establish the nose weight of their van as usually packed for a trip. Unless you wildly change what you are carrying, and you re-pack your caravan in a known way as most of us do, there is

Reading this post which started with a simple question, it's no wonder a newbie can get confused looking at towing weights, train weights etc, but what does shout out is a manufacturer gives a tow bal

When unladen some caravans have a noseweight well in excess of the towbar limit, others have almost zero noseweight. It’s always a matter of adjusting to suit.

Posted Images

9 minutes ago, Rodders53 said:

Nope that is typically the vehicle manufacturer (but can be reduced by other factors/items in the equation as you state).

 

My first Galaxy (09 plate) I hawked around the local towbar fitters to find any that permitted the then current Ford nose weight allowance of 90kg.  Many were still only rated at the previous Ford figure of 80kg.  

 

The Bosal bar fitted to my vehicle had a limit of 100kg on its rating plate and instruction book.  I was - of course - limited by the Ford handbook's 90kg.

Out of interest Does your current vehicle handbook state Max noseweight or recommended noseweight?

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, halifaxdan said:

I would check you car handbook. If it is like mine it is only a recommended noseweight. Nowhere does it mention that it is a limit (in my handbook anyway).  

If you check your handbook will you let me know if it’s max noseweight or recommended please. I am intrigued now. 

Just by looking in the handbook is no good. My handbook is generic over the 5 series range. As they took one out of a 535i saloon and I have a 520d touring

Lunar Solaris 1 Limited Edition Hopefully Behind A

BMW 520D MSport Touring. ...

 

***** Jack of all Trades. ... Master of None *****

Link to post
Share on other sites

All three of the Ford Galaxy handbooks I have state the maximum permissible nose weight in them somewhere.

The current 19 plate, online-only handbook  states "The vertical weight on the tow ball should be at least 4% of the trailer weight and not exceed the maximum permissible weight. See Capacities and Specifications." with the 90kg contained therein for all models or a VIN-based sub-set (as it's online).

Ford has a quite comprehensive Towing section in their handbooks.  

 

But this is drifting off thread:  Other than 4% of 1300kg is 52kg so I'd say that 55kg with the Adria the OP proposes will be - just - adequate.  But if (and it inevitably will be) laden to 1300kg it will be taxing the towcar's capability to the limit?

  • Thanks 1

2012 Bailey Pegasus 2 Rimini towed by 2019 Ford Galaxy Titanium X, 2.0 EcoBlue, 8 speed auto.

Link to post
Share on other sites

If anyone needs convincing about the importance of nose weight have a look at this video

image.png

  • Like 1

Life is not a rehearsal . . .:)

Porsche Cayenne S Diesel & Knaus StarClass 695. Previously Audi S4 Avant & Elddis Super Sirocco

Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, halifaxdan said:

I would check you car handbook. If it is like mine it is only a recommended noseweight. Nowhere does it mention that it is a limit (in my handbook anyway).  

If you check your handbook will you let me know if it’s max noseweight or recommended please. I am intrigued now. 

Having now checked it, the Citroen C3 Picasso (1.6ltr diesel) handbook says

"Recommended nose weight 54kgs" I said 55kg from memory.

The after-market towbar fitted by a non Citroen supplier has marked the towball frame ""max load 75kg". I was incorrect when I said it was 100kg.

 

Whilst the towing bracket frame is unlikely to come adrift from the chassis, I do not exceed the 54/5kg figure for fear of unweighting the front driving wheels. Even so, I have occasionally had wheel slip when pulling away uphill from a standing start on a wet road.

1 hour ago, KnausCol said:

If anyone needs convincing about the importance of nose weight have a look at this video

image.png

That demonstrates load distribution on the trailer, not noseweight.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

I wonder how many people are towing heavyish caravans (Mine is 1420kg gross) with 60kg noseweights. Probably  battling with gas bottle relocations etc, and potentially making the caravan slightly less stable because, like me, they thought the handbook figure was max noseweight. I’ve been towing at 72kg noseweight but next time I will be taking it to 100kg as per the AL-KO a frame. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, halifaxdan said:

I wonder how many people are towing heavyish caravans (Mine is 1420kg gross) with 60kg noseweights. Probably  battling with gas bottle relocations etc, and potentially making the caravan slightly less stable because, like me, they thought the handbook figure was max noseweight. I’ve been towing at 72kg noseweight but next time I will be taking it to 100kg as per the AL-KO a frame. 

If you have never had a problem when keeping to the lower weight, why risk causing vehicle damage and adverse car handling by changing now?

Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, halifaxdan said:

I’ve been towing at 72kg noseweight but next time I will be taking it to 100kg as per the AL-KO a frame. 

Check out the plate on the towbar before doing that;  as it may have a lower S-value than the trailer hitch max 100kg.  (Albeit the S-value might exceed the car maker's limit as per my 2009 Galaxy's Bosal).

 

NB

For 1420 kg 4%= 57 kg 5%= 71 and 7%= 99 (kg) to the nearest whole kg so 71 is within the 5-7% 'ideal range'.

My 1499 kg gives 60, 75 and 105 kg.  I generally go around the 80-85 mark for a comfortable tow within my rated limits.

 

 

 

 

Edited by Rodders53

2012 Bailey Pegasus 2 Rimini towed by 2019 Ford Galaxy Titanium X, 2.0 EcoBlue, 8 speed auto.

Link to post
Share on other sites

There are three potential nose weight limits the lowest of which must not be exceeded,

 

They are:

  • Car.
  • Caravan chassis
  • Aftermarket tow bracket if  fitted.

AL-KO frequently quote 100kg on the caravan which fits in mostly  with the 5-7% estimate.

 

A low nose weight if imposed by the lowest i.e. the car in the threads example , will make for a poor towing experience - that is polite wording.

 

In the example here  a 55kg car noseweight means a caravan at 1,100 kg  (5%) or 785kg (7%) if my maths is right! would be stable - a low weight indeed for modern vans.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, daveat92 said:

That demonstrates load distribution on the trailer, not noseweight.

Granted strictly speaking, but the way people control/change their nose weight is usually by altering the weight distribution within the van so I think it's a valid point to make.

Life is not a rehearsal . . .:)

Porsche Cayenne S Diesel & Knaus StarClass 695. Previously Audi S4 Avant & Elddis Super Sirocco

Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, KnausCol said:

Granted strictly speaking, but the way people control/change their nose weight is usually by altering the weight distribution within the van so I think it's a valid point to make.

Yes, you are right, but the video only shows weights at the extremes of the trailer, not in the centre, over the axle, which is where we are always being advised to put anything heavy.

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, daveat92 said:

Yes, you are right, but the video only shows weights at the extremes of the trailer, not in the centre, over the axle, which is where we are always being advised to put anything heavy.

True, but this is a thread about nose weight and weight over the axle will not significantly affect nose weight. People wanting to change nose weight will usually distribute weight forwards or rearwards appropriately so it is worth pointing out the danger of adversely affecting weight distribution.

Life is not a rehearsal . . .:)

Porsche Cayenne S Diesel & Knaus StarClass 695. Previously Audi S4 Avant & Elddis Super Sirocco

Link to post
Share on other sites

It's very amusing all this heart rending about nose weights on this forum. Next time you are on a campsite watch all the caravaners packing up to leave, how many actualy check their noseweight? I always check mine and more than once I have been asked what I am doing and why am I wasting time faffing about.

If the noseweight is that important why are the roads not littered with dead caravans?

 

 

  • Like 1

'I know' is just 'I Believe' with delusions of grandeur

Mitsubishi Outlander 2.4 PHEV 4H

Unicorn 4 Cadiz

Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Artleknock said:

Next time you are on a campsite watch all the caravaners packing up to leave, how many actually check their noseweight? I always check mine and more than once I have been asked what I am doing and why am I wasting time faffing about.

 

Most people establish the nose weight of their van as usually packed for a trip. Unless you wildly change what you are carrying, and you re-pack your caravan in a known way as most of us do, there is no need to constantly re-check it. So I wouldn't expect to see people on camp sites doing so.

  • I agree completely 4

Life is not a rehearsal . . .:)

Porsche Cayenne S Diesel & Knaus StarClass 695. Previously Audi S4 Avant & Elddis Super Sirocco

Link to post
Share on other sites

The Towbar and hitch are used in all sorts of different cars and vans, just like caravan axles, which are produced to multiples of 50kg or 100kg limits. The car's noseweight limit/recommendation is based on a number of factors, just like their towing limit. It might be the strength of the bolt fixings for the towbar, it might be the propensity for bodywork to be pulled out of shape or the rear springs capacity to handle shock loads etc, etc. Just because the towbar can handle 100kg, doesn't mean the car's frame or construction can.   

I've got nothing to do on this hot afternoon

but to settle down and write you a line.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Never bother to check ours. Load sensibly with one gas and load car not the van.

  • I disagree 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, KnausCol said:

Most people establish the nose weight of their van as usually packed for a trip. Unless you wildly change what you are carrying, and you re-pack your caravan in a known way as most of us do, there is no need to constantly re-check it. So I wouldn't expect to see people on camp sites doing so.

Agree - but the only variable is the weather - because that determines how many and what clothes Madam packs! With those two huge wardrobes at the back, she has a temptation to fill them 'just in case'. I always check the noseweight before we set off but don't bother on site because I know most of the clothes are still there;) I usually aim for about 95kg, which from experience have found to give the best tow.

  • Like 1

VW Touareg Escape towing a 2018 Knaus Starclass 695

Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Steamdrivenandy said:

100kg limits. The car's noseweight limit/recommendation is based on a number of factors, just like their.   

This is the part I am interested in investigating further. You said “limit/recommendation” is if they are the same thing, are they?

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, halifaxdan said:

This is the part I am interested in investigating further. You said “limit/recommendation” is if they are the same thing, are they?


If you see previous posts some manufacturers use the word limit and others recommendation.

2018 Volvo V90 and 2018 Swift Sprite Quattro EB

Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, GaryB1969 said:


If you see previous posts some manufacturers use the word limit and others recommendation.

If some dies due to an accident I am sure the police will see a whole world of difference between recommended and max limit when it comes to prosecution time. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, KnausCol said:

Most people establish the nose weight of their van as usually packed for a trip. Unless you wildly change what you are carrying, and you re-pack your caravan in a known way as most of us do, there is no need to constantly re-check it. So I wouldn't expect to see people on camp sites doing so.

I know from experience that that doesn't always work. A few years ago we were away for 7 weeks, three around Scotland, three around N.Ireland and a week at C&CC Keswick. I checked the noseweight at leaving each campsite exept the last one. Nearly lost the caravan on the M6 when a lorry passed me. Stopped at Southwaite services to see why, the noseweight was 35kg, and I thought everything was packed the same as usual.

6 minutes ago, halifaxdan said:

If some dies due to an accident I am sure the police will see a whole world of difference between recommended and max limit when it comes to prosecution time. 

In the case of an accident the contents of the caravan will move. How will anyone know what the noseweight was?

Before any comments are made, I always (now) check my noseweight.

  • Like 1

'I know' is just 'I Believe' with delusions of grandeur

Mitsubishi Outlander 2.4 PHEV 4H

Unicorn 4 Cadiz

Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Artleknock said:

 

In the case of an accident the contents of the caravan will move. How will anyone know what the noseweight was?

Before any comments are made, I always (now) check my noseweight.

Very good point. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Op. Fwiw I have an Adria 542dk max weight 1300 kg.

The nose weight when empty is fairly high. I think you'd struggle to get it down to 75kg let alone 50 odd.

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

I think you have a problem, although you can just about get the noseweight down to the minimum of 4% needed to stay within the accepted safe limit.  If the manufacturer says 55 kg then I would take that as the legal limit, it is very low though and when a replacement is due for the car I would look for something a bit better. Your registration document should show the legal limit though.

Edited by Wildwood
Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...