2010 Swift Challenger 540

[Carga]

Hi,

My son has just bought his first caravan.  It was a private sale and everything seems fine except that without the benefit of a full briefing on all the controls he is unable to get hot water from the electric.  He has located the gas control and hot water flows but he can't locate the electric control switch.

the water heater on the Sargent PCU is on but we feel there has to be a fused switch somewhere to get hot water off the electrics.

can anyone shed light on this

[Tuningdrew]

Hi, and welcome.

I take it the caravan is connected to the mains?

[ericfield]

This is the handbook for 2010 Swifts...

 

https://orbit.brightbox.com/v1/acc-jqzwj/Swift/handbooks/pdfs/000/000/024/original/1089175__Caravan_Owners_Handbook_2010.pdf?1472743472

 

 

 

And technical specs here...

 

https://orbit.brightbox.com/v1/acc-jqzwj/Swift/handbooks/pdfs/000/000/102/original/Challenger-Conqueror_Tech_Handbook_2010.pdf?1472743525

Edited August 3, 2020 by ericfield

[joanie]

truma ultrastore,  see on you tube

 

the hot water wont work  on an empty tank, to reset , switch it all off and wait  30 minutes , make sure the water tank is full and start again

Edited August 3, 2020 by joanie

[Arrand]

the main switch for the hot water is located by the mains consumer unit (the one with the trip switches ) if this isn't working  then you possibly have a blown heater element

[Carga]

Thanks to all for your responses.

Tank is full and generating hot water off the gas.  Yes connected to the mains and the water heater button in the PCU is glowing green.  Have looked through the manual but can't find what I'm looking for.  Have scoured you tube without joy for this specific model.  I have the operating instructions for ultra store that came with the van which shows a fused rocker switch but doesn't say where it's located in the van.

update... My wife just found something on you tube which suggests it may be in the bottom of the wardrobe.  Did look in there but full of clothes at the time so may have missed it.  If not there off to a friendly Swift dealer I suppose?.

Thanks again all.

[Carga]

Update.    ? Not in the wardrobe

[joanie]

https://www.caravantalk.co.uk/community/topic/35368-how-do-i-work-the-hot-water-system-in-my-caravan/

 this is a thread from 2010, it may help

[Legal Eagle]

3 hours ago, Carga said:

Thanks to all for your responses.

Tank is full and generating hot water off the gas.  Yes connected to the mains and the water heater button in the PCU is glowing green.  Have looked through the manual but can't find what I'm looking for.  Have scoured you tube without joy for this specific model.  I have the operating instructions for ultra store that came with the van which shows a fused rocker switch but doesn't say where it's located in the van.

update... My wife just found something on you tube which suggests it may be in the bottom of the wardrobe.  Did look in there but full of clothes at the time so may have missed it.  If not there off to a friendly Swift dealer I suppose?.

Thanks again all.

With a Sargent PSU there will be no other switches other than the Truma wall mounted controls (the pre-Sargent system was in the wardrobe with rocker switches). According to the handbook, the charger "on" indicator is green. The water heater push button switch is, I believe, amber.

[Carga]

Thanks for the link Joani but it's not answered my question.
Not in the van at present Legal Eagle so I may be mistaken about green but all lights on the PSU are on.
Unfortunately the only controls I can find are the ones labelled Ultraheater which has 3 settings - 500, 1000 & 2000 which must relate to the heating, and one labelled Ultrastorage. This has "O" for off and a gas symbol plus a rotary temperature control. This controls water heating by gas. No other controls within the vicinity of these.
To my mind and indeed according to the operating instruction there has to be a fused rocker switch somewhere for the electric?
Have posted a question on the Swift website.
Thanks again.

[ericfield]

From memory ...on my 2012 Swift there was an electric water heater rocker switch down at floor level alongside an aerial socket? at the base of the front offside bench seat where it meets the front drawer unit. My wife was forever switching it on and off with her heel!!

 

I rewired it up top alongside the gas control switch. Why it was ever so ridiculously and remotely positioned from the gas switch I will never know.  Worth getting on your knees and having a look.

Edited August 4, 2020 by ericfield

[Carga]

Thanks Ericfield.  We were out in the van last week pitched opposite a 2012 Challenger.  He had a switch for the electric exactly where you describe.  Wish it were the case for the 2010.

[Eddie]

9 hours ago, Carga said:

Have posted a question on the Swift website.
 

Are you sure it went through alright, because I can't see it anywhere?

[ericfield]

2 hours ago, Carga said:

Thanks Ericfield.  We were out in the van last week pitched opposite a 2012 Challenger.  He had a switch for the electric exactly where you describe.  Wish it were the case for the 2010.

Don’t suppose you can trace the wiring back from  the Ultrastore to at least get some sense of direction? The technical booklet link above has got the wiring diagrams.

[Lockin]

This may help, there should be an electrical isolator switch as well as the RCD on the main panel. We had a 2010 540 and i'm sure the electric heater isolator was near the gas heater control

 

[Arrand]

13 hours ago, Lockin said:

This may help, there should be an electrical isolator switch as well as the RCD on the main panel. We had a 2010 540 and i'm sure the electric heater isolator was near the gas heater control

 

this is for when using the ultrastore on gas, there should be a seperate rocker switch somewhere for electric, usually with the main consumer unit

[Carga]

Visited the van yesterday (son's van in storage).  So here's the latest.

Eddie, I submitted the question on th Swift contact page site. No reason to believe it didn't go through but they say up to 5 days for response.  I intend ringing them today.

Lockin / Arrand, checked all around the van (again), still no sign of the rocker switch.  There is a fuse in the Ultrastore which I checked and replaced.  There was a white cable which I traced as far as I could.  It went behind the front cabinet where I lost sight of it.

There are two sets of instructions which seem to contradict each other.  The Truman operating instruction show a fused rocker switch such as shown in the video posted by Lockin.  The other, a Swift booklet, says the electric is automatic leading me to reconsider Legal Eagles' comments, I'd no switch with sat gent PSU's.

Don't know about the water but this is making my blood boil (haha).

Will post if/when I can speak to Swift

Thanks again all.

I'd no switch with sat gent PSU's should read... i.e. no switch with Sargent PSU's

[Legal Eagle]

You may wait quite a while, if indeed you do get a response. Swift aren't resuming full factory operations until 1st September. Currently they have very limited staffing levels and in any case close at 2pm on Fridays. I'm not sure when they're 2 week Summer shutdown is, probably within the next week or so.

[joanie]

can you visit a swift dealer with workshop and ask a  few questions. 

Edited August 7, 2020 by joanie

[Silversurf]

1 hour ago, Carga said:

Visited the van yesterday (son's van in storage).  So here's the latest.

Eddie, I submitted the question on th Swift contact page site. No reason to believe it didn't go through but they say up to 5 days for response.  I intend ringing them today.

Lockin / Arrand, checked all around the van (again), still no sign of the rocker switch.  There is a fuse in the Ultrastore which I checked and replaced.  There was a white cable which I traced as far as I could.  It went behind the front cabinet where I lost sight of it.

There are two sets of instructions which seem to contradict each other.  The Truman operating instruction show a fused rocker switch such as shown in the video posted by Lockin.  The other, a Swift booklet, says the electric is automatic leading me to reconsider Legal Eagles' comments, I'd no switch with sat gent PSU's.

Don't know about the water but this is making my blood boil (haha).

Will post if/when I can speak to Swift

Thanks again all.

I'd no switch with sat gent PSU's should read... i.e. no switch with Sargent PSU's

 

Is your PSU a Sargent EC500 ? I've got one knocking about in one of my workshops and a wiring diagram for it.

 

There is the possibility that the water heater switch on the PSU switches the element, if so the white cable you partially traced would end up at the back of the PSU.

 

A bit of an odd way to be honest to just rely on the mcb ( number 3 ) to trip with a water heater fault because this also serves the fridge and 12v charger, and you would have no quick way of checking which one of the three had the fault on, other than switching off the charger, green switch and water heater , white switch.

 

I think that there may be a fused spur tucked away somewhere, you will have to follow the heater cable back to the PSU and hope to come across one.

 

Can you use a multimeter, if so, the next step is to be on mains, switch on the heater at the PSU and see if you are getting  240v across the heater element terminals, if not you have an open circuit between the heater and PSU which could be a blown hidden fuse.

 

If you do have 240v this then points to the possibility of a faulty element, WITH THE MAINS SWITCHED OFF AND UNPLUGGED, disconnect the heater element terminals, with the meter set on Ohms you should should get a reading of x  Ohms( I can't remember the exact figure) if you are getting no reading it looks like the element is open circuit.

 

There is a recent thread on CT within the last few days with a heater element fault it may be worth having a read through it.

 

Edit, whilst you have access to the heater terminals you could check for cable continuity back to the PSU, it would mean gaining access to the back of the PSU, if you need to do this let me know and I'll tell you which multi-plug is used for the heater and which pins to test at, presuming it is a EC 500

 

Edited August 7, 2020 by Silversurf

[Rodders53]

The manuals linked to give all the relevant basic information.

 

MCB3 (10A) feeds and protects the water heater and cabling... also feeding the charger and fridge (page 70 of user handbook).  The water heater is switched on that PDU (see page 67).  There will be no other switch on a Swift group caravan for the water heater.

The mains cable to the heater allegedly has a blue outer covering and is plugged into connector 1 of the pdu (with the fridge mains cable, black outer) - page 10 of the technical handbook wiring diagrams.  So ought to be simple enough to find?

 

This problem needs a multumeter and a competent user of such.  It will be simple enough to check if mains 240V is found at the water heater mains input after removing the cover.  You may need to find a copy of the Truma Ultrastore installation manual (Swift used to supply that in a big folder of OEM manuals) to refer to.

 

If mains is there, but not heating the water, then either the overheat cutout switch has failed open or the 850 Watt heater element has failed open circuit (though they often fail short circuit to earth, which trips the RCD).  Any competent diy electrical person should be able to isolate the mains and then check the heater element circuit components using the multimeter.  If you aren't comfortable / competent it needs a mobile tech or caravan dealer to investigate, confirm the fault and propose a fix.  NB heater element failure is common enough on these units.

 

If no mains then it needs a track and trace of the cable between PDU and water heater.   There might be connectors en route to simplify the production line installation and where a break might occur and allow checking with a multimeter.  It's possible even that the switch on the PDU is not making good contact so not sending 240V down the cable (simple switches don't often fail, but they can).

Edited August 7, 2020 by Rodders53