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Fireman Iain

The future of Battery Electric Vehicles?

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IBM have just announced an innovative new battery design. Still in its infancy, but it makes some interesting promises. 
 

For one, it doesn’t use any heavy metals, all of its clever tech can be made from seawater. 
 

Also promising very rapid charge to 80%. Plus higher capacity. It looks like they’re at small scale at the moment, but there’s already Talk of of using them for BEVs. 
 

https://www.ibm.com/blogs/research/2019/12/heavy-metal-free-battery/
 

I’m no advocate of hybrids or BEVs as things stand, but this looks interesting. 

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The road to a suitable battery for EVs (High energy density, quick and easy recharge, low environmental impact at all stages, long life, safe etc.) is littered with false starts maybe, only maybe, this one will make it.

But it still leaves the other major hurdles, recharge infrastructure and environmental friendly generation, to be resolved! 

Maybe, someday!

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26 minutes ago, Fireman Iain said:

IBM have just announced an innovative new battery design. Still in its infancy, but it makes some interesting promises. 
 

For one, it doesn’t use any heavy metals, all of its clever tech can be made from seawater. 
 

Also promising very rapid charge to 80%. Plus higher capacity. It looks like they’re at small scale at the moment, but there’s already Talk of of using them for BEVs. 
 

https://www.ibm.com/blogs/research/2019/12/heavy-metal-free-battery/
 

I’m no advocate of hybrids or BEVs as things stand, but this looks interesting. 

 

The future will happen - we just don't know when!

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Just now, Black Grouse said:

 

The future will happen - we just don't know when!

Or what it will contain!

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Very interesting . But why we never started 50 years ago into research when we all knew burning fossil fuels was not the answer with pollution and oil was not going to last forever ?

 

 

Dave

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19 minutes ago, CommanderDave said:

Very interesting . But why we never started 50 years ago into research when we all knew burning fossil fuels was not the answer with pollution and oil was not going to last forever ?

 

 

Dave

Simple! Electric vehicles have been around since the very early days of motoring (19th century), but until recently there has been no battery technology that looked to have the potential to be even close to competing with the ICE for mainstream motoring.

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And there was no need to look /develop battery power or look elsewhere and no incentive and the oil companies(perhaps and so rumour says) tried to prevent it and and and!!!!!!

I share your frustration-whatever the reason complacency has meant we've not developed battery power and have simply gone down the fossil fuel route at a pace. Wake up call and it is slowly gaining momentum! 

 

Edited by Jezzerb

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2 minutes ago, Jezzerb said:

And there was no need to look /develop battery power or look elsewhere and no incentive and the oil companies(perhaps and so rumour says) tried to prevent it and and and!!!!!!


The Man With The Golden Gun is worth watching 

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Oil still controls governments is a major cause of war and redraws political maps.

The oil companies have a long history of buying up patents on alternative energy systems crushing alternative R&D and impeding progress they deem not to be in their interest eg the infamous “lead in petrol” scandal where it took Greenpiece to fund construction of an engine that ran lead free petrol before they caved in and removed the lead additive.

Although we have moved from 7 oil companies controlling 85% of the worlds oil

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_Sisters_(oil_companies)

to nations controlling oil the bad old ways persist of trying to control rival technology.

As a user of state of the art off the shelf batteries for my drones RC aircraft and RC helicopters battery technology for transport has still a long way to go.

Imagine how quickly battery technology would advance if it got the subsidies and tax benefits the oil industry gets.

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19 minutes ago, ancell said:

 

 

Imagine how quickly battery technology would advance if it got the subsidies and tax benefits the oil industry gets.

You shouldn't overstate that argument, R & D money only goes so far, Big advances in technology start from brilliant ideas, not endless research down what may turn out to be dead ends. So far, it remains to be seen whether any of the existing technologies have the potential to fill the need.

Edited by Stevan

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To give a random statistic about research success.  The pharmaceutical industry (which for years has been using heavily targeted R&D) reckon that for every 10,000 compounds which they investigate ONE makes it to market...

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2 hours ago, ancell said:

Imagine how quickly battery technology would advance if it got the subsidies and tax benefits the oil industry gets.

Eh?  What subsidies does the oil industry get?  They have to pay a license just to search for oil.

 

Renewables are already heavily subsidised and that is an indirect subsidy to large-scale electricity storage system manufacturers as it expands their customer numbers.

Edited by kelper

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10 hours ago, kelper said:

Eh?  What subsidies does the oil industry get?  They have to pay a license just to search for oil.

 

Renewables are already heavily subsidised and that is an indirect subsidy to large-scale electricity storage system manufacturers as it expands their customer numbers.

 

According to this

https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2019/05/how-much-does-world-subsidize-oil-coal-and-gas/589000/

global subsidy for oil stands at $400 billion to $5.2 trillion per annum for fossil fuels depending on how the numbers are calculated.

While the European governments make land transport fuel just another way to contribute to government coffers other governments subsidise road fuel eg the USA.

Global fossil fuel subsidies have risen from $200 billion in 2010 to $600 billion by 2015.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_subsidy

Just sticking with overall UK energy storage we are building an  inadequate number of base load power stations assuming European nuclear power will be fed via our existing and future international connectors.

Wonder how much we will pay after the end of this month?

Perhaps it will incentivise wave power schemes and tidal barrages?

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That's an interesting article but reinvents the meaning of subsidy!  

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BP own majority of the charging points so they can't loose if we go over to electric ?

 

 

Dave

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12 hours ago, CommanderDave said:

BP own majority of the charging points so they can't loose if we go over to electric ?

 

 

Dave

 

Having said that seven oil companies including BP used to control 85%! of the worlds oil in the 70s

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_Sisters_(oil_companies)

Now it’s less than 10% thanks to nations nationalising their oil-except us😀.

If we really try to run most of our 38.2 million vehicles

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/800502/vehicle-licensing-statistics-2018.pdf

   

on plug in recharge batteries we are going to need £billions of investment just in our ancient cable networks never mind base load oil-gas-nuclear power stations.

 

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16 minutes ago, FrankBullet said:

...and the future is brighter still;

 

https://www.alko-tech.com/en/trailer-platform

 

I think you’ll need a B+E, mind!

If they put a decent jockey wheel on it and a seat behind it, you could do away with the car.

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On 23/12/2019 at 23:52, ancell said:

 

 

Global fossil fuel subsidies have risen from $200 billion in 2010 to $600 billion by 2015.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_subsidy

Just sticking with overall UK energy storage we are building an  inadequate number of base load power stations assuming European nuclear power will be fed via our existing and future international connectors.

Wonder how much we will pay after the end of this month?

Perhaps it will incentivise wave power schemes and tidal barrages?

 

I find a these articles very one sided. They class payments like the Capacity Market as subsidies.  If you want an industry to be in private hands and want the plant to be stood most of the year then yes there has to be a mechanism to pay for the plant to stay open and stay available for when demand is high, it's dark and the wind isn't blowing.

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Our milkman used to deliver milk in glass recyclable bottles in his electric powered milk float in the 1970's............... Greta would be proud! 

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the same for us in the 1950s.  In fact as far as I can remember milk floats were still around in 1980s possibly later. I dont know when  glass milk bottles were phased out but I guess it was during the 90s 

 

We also had a regular collection of waste and stuff for recycling by a bloke with a horse and cart which also had the advantage of free manure was available to those who wanted it

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The Rag and Bone man!  But mostly it seemed to be cookers and fridges on his cart.

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We still have milk delivered in glass bottles, which are recycled,

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8 hours ago, Borussia 1900 said:

Our milkman used to deliver milk in glass recyclable bottles in his electric powered milk float in the 1970's............... Greta would be proud! 

 

I used to drive that milk float age 15!

Umpteen crates of milk every day on my Coop milk round.

Until the fateful day Jackie the milkman said I was to slow in stopping😂😂.

Took he and I most of the day to clean the van up.

I was not fired because he said I was only doing what I was told.

I think he was relieved I was not killed by a ton of steel milk crates filled with glass milk bottles crashing into the front of the van.

 

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On 23/12/2019 at 10:53, ancell said:

the infamous “lead in petrol” scandal where it took Greenpiece to fund construction of an engine that ran lead free petrol before they caved in

 

That sounds unlikely, do you have a reference for that? A non-Greanpeace one please as they have a reputation for telling lies, supposedly for the greater good.  The development ot lead-free engines by car makers was made imperative by legislation enacted in phases from the early 1970's and was initiated by indications of such legislation long before that.

 

As descibed here for example :

https://www.eesi.org/papers/view/fact-sheet-a-brief-history-of-octane

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