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Warning - unbelievable design feature


CliveB
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I have owned my Pegasus for just over a year now and have encountered all of the normal (for Bailey) bits coming unstuck, dropping off, needing adjustment ... Poor build quality.

But today my wife cut herself badly on a design feature whilst cleaninh the door frame which beggars belief.

Check your threshold for a razor sharp dagger strip.  How on earth did this get through any safety check?

 

 

 

 

IMG_20190831_121259371.jpg

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Bad and even more dangerous for little fingers crawling around the floor .

 

 

 

Dave

Jeep Commander 3. 0 V6 CRD

Isuzu D- Max Utah Auto

Elddis Crusader Storm 2000 Kgs, Unipart Royal Atlas Mover .

 

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And my Phoenix!!

 

Perhaps the OP should send his photograph (and medical bill!) to Bailey.

 

I am now going into the workshop to get a file out and round the edges off.

 

Thanks for the heads up Clive :Thankyou:   :goodpost:

 

Andy

Experience is something you acquire after you have an urgent need for it.

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25 minutes ago, Sea&Sand said:

I think an injury compensation claim would be successful in this case.

 

Oh dear! 

 

Standby for the “Living room lawyers” posting how to go about it and what sort of figure you should settle for, and how much their sisters next door neighbours boyfriends aunt got for finding  a bluebottle in a bottle of tomato ketchup whilst on a train in Outer Mongolia..... blah blah blah......

Experience is something you acquire after you have an urgent need for it.

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28 minutes ago, Sea&Sand said:

I think an injury compensation claim would be successful in this case.

I don't.

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Just now, Legal Eagle said:

I don't.

 

Hurrah!! 

 

Hopefully that will scotch the whole idea (but I doubt it, too many Living room lawyers around) 

 

Andy

Experience is something you acquire after you have an urgent need for it.

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34 minutes ago, Legal Eagle said:

I don't.

Interested to know why it would fail L.E., I'm not disagreeing just curious if you wouldnt mind sharing the reasons why.

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Yep, mine was the same, but not any longer.

 

A few minutes with a light file, took all the sharp edges off.

 

Thanks for the heads up CliveB!

 

Bailey won't care, unless & until, employees get lots of injuries, which they clearly have not.  Luckily it seems, norhas anyone other than Mrs CliveB , as it is the first we have been told of.

 

Customers are two a penny, so it's likely Bailey will have not a care for the likes of us.

 

 

Bailey Orion News & Information - 

 

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Watch the door catch on the frame too.  I caught my arm on it when taking stuff out. Wife put a bit of tape over it.

It will get gentle filing along with door strip.

Hyundai Santa Fe+Bailey Unicorn Cadiz

Mini Cooper convertible -fun Car!:)

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53 minutes ago, AJGalaxy2012 said:

Interested to know why it would fail L.E., I'm not disagreeing just curious if you wouldnt mind sharing the reasons why.

Whilst I cannot predict what a Court might ultimately rule, a claim would be highly unlikely to see the light of day. The question to ask is what significant injury is there to actually claim anything for? There is no evidence of negligence, just a sharp edge on a metal door step.

To start with the cause of the injury isn't in an area where contact is likely to be common or a high risk (door step threshold). In this case the caravan has been owned for just over a year and the injury only recently occurred during cleaning. I've lost count of the number of times I caught a knuckle on the windscreen wiper arm whilst cleaning the car,  hardly grounds for a claim though!

Whilst no doubt painful and although described as a bad cut I'm assuming it didn't need hospital treatment and therefore no subsequent follow up treatment so no medical report. Nor will it result in time off work or any other major inconvenience justifying compensation for loss of income. It would be all but impossible to base a claim for injury compensation on what we know in this case.

Edited by Legal Eagle
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2 hours ago, Legal Eagle said:

Whilst I cannot predict what a Court might ultimately rule, a claim would be highly unlikely to see the light of day. The question to ask is what significant injury is there to actually claim anything for? There is no evidence of negligence, just a sharp edge on a metal door step.

To start with the cause of the injury isn't in an area where contact is likely to be common or a high risk (door step threshold). In this case the caravan has been owned for just over a year and the injury only recently occurred during cleaning. I've lost count of the number of times I caught a knuckle on the windscreen wiper arm whilst cleaning the car,  hardly grounds for a claim though!

Whilst no doubt painful and although described as a bad cut I'm assuming it didn't need hospital treatment and therefore no subsequent follow up treatment so no medical report. Nor will it result in time off work or any other major inconvenience justifying compensation for loss of income. It would be all but impossible to base a claim for injury compensation on what we know in this case.

Thanks for the info. Just one point, doesn't a manufacturer have a duty of care to it's customers to make sure their products are safe? clearly this one isn't and is a flaw in the design (are Baileys designed or do they just happen?) in terms of likelihood, bare feet, children I would have said are the likely candidates for a mishap.

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34 minutes ago, AJGalaxy2012 said:

Thanks for the info. Just one point, doesn't a manufacturer have a duty of care to it's customers to make sure their products are safe? clearly this one isn't and is a flaw in the design (are Baileys designed or do they just happen?) in terms of likelihood, bare feet, children I would have said are the likely candidates for a mishap.

 

Can I suggest you read LE’s post carefully. He has explained fully why he considers the chances of a successful action are remote. 

 

Perhaps you would like to instigate an action against Bailey if you are that certain.

 

Andy

 

 

Experience is something you acquire after you have an urgent need for it.

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Most manufacturers use the Hartal door so would surmise that pretty much all caravans manufactured in the uk will have the threshold strip.  Granted it should have been rounded off during manufacture but i wouldn't have thought it possible to locate every sharp edge object on a caravan. 

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This is not a fault in the manufacture, as I intimated in the title it's a deliberate design "feature". There is absolutely no need for it to be cut in this way (Bailey or Hartal? If the latter won't all caravans be affected?) 

One of my pet hates is the trend towards design over practicality

Let's get more engineers with common sense involved and not design/media graduates.

(Slightly tongue in cheek before I'm shot down)

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Well I hope Clive's wife is on the way to recovery.

hawkaye :beardy:

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3 hours ago, Cvan1 said:

Most manufacturers use the Hartal door so would surmise that pretty much all caravans manufactured in the uk will have the threshold strip.  Granted it should have been rounded off during manufacture but i wouldn't have thought it possible to locate every sharp edge object on a caravan. 

The Compass Capiro has a different, and safer, design.

 

It should be possible to identify every hazard, or potential hazard on any kit offered to customers, the design for each component should be risk assessed. I supply and install industrial equipment to the manufacturing industry, I have to supply documentation showing I’ve assessed all items and found to be safe or provided instructions and or hazard labels where appropriate.

 

Im amazed the Bailey has that feature, that should have been stopped at the design stage.

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19 hours ago, AJGalaxy2012 said:

Thanks for the info. Just one point, doesn't a manufacturer have a duty of care to it's customers to make sure their products are safe? clearly this one isn't and is a flaw in the design (are Baileys designed or do they just happen?) in terms of likelihood, bare feet, children I would have said are the likely candidates for a mishap.

It's  a door threshold strip and, as I said, injurious contact is highly unlikely to occur. For the length of time they have been fitted, if it were dangerous for bare feet we would have known about it by now. It only happened in this case through cleaning, not being stepped on. Judging by the responses on this thread no one with the same threshold strip has even noticed it up until now, let alone been injured, so proving any negligence in a duty of care would be impossible. In other words, with only one reported, relatively minor, injury from the thousands of threshold strips fitted how do you satisfy a Court there is a serious risk of injury or even a design fault?

You can give your knee a nasty knock, or  small child can bang their head, on the square edge of a wooden coffee table. I don't think anyone would think twice about that being negligence in a duty of care or a design fault.

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3 hours ago, Dave Capiro owner said:

 

 

Im amazed the Bailey has that feature, that should have been stopped at the design stage.

Given that the likelihood of of an accident  is low (only the one reported incident above) and the severity of injury would also be low, what would you score on your risk assessment for this particular component ?

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4 hours ago, CliveB said:

Let's get more engineers with common sense involved and not design/media graduates

 

Why are media graduates designing caravans? Seems a bit odd. 

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15 minutes ago, Minion 63 said:

Given that the likelihood of of an accident  is low (only the one reported incident above) and the severity of injury would also be low, what would you score on your risk assessment for this particular component ?

 

Thats immaterial,   Even if the score is very low it should have been picked up at the design stage as Dave quite correctly identified, and rectified.  Not difficult.

 

That’s not suggesting a claim would be successful or practical.  Just common sense and good practice.

 

And, as AJ asked, of course the manufacturer has a duty of care to the end user.

 

A thought.  Apart from filing.  Perhaps the ends could be bent inwards slightly.

 

John

 

 

 

Edited by JCloughie

Volvo V70 D3 SE (was Peugeot 4007, SsangYong Korando), Pulling a Lunar Clubman SI 2015. If you are depressed, you are living in the past. If you are anxious, you are living in the future. If you are at peace, you are living in the present.

 

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IMO, if you want to look for safety hazard related "unbelievable design feature" in many of our caravans, then putting a microwave over the hob must be way higher than the issue giving concern here?

 

 

 

 

Edited by JTQ
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22 hours ago, Mr Plodd said:

 

Can I suggest you read LE’s post carefully. He has explained fully why he considers the chances of a successful action are remote. 

 

Perhaps you would like to instigate an action against Bailey if you are that certain.

 

Andy

 

 

Hi Andy,

I did read his post carefully. I used to work for a company making packaging machines and the lengths we had to go to to protect people from injury was extraordinary hence why I asked do they not have a duty of care. Im interested in what LE has to say because what would seem common sense and obvious to most of us the law is different, I'm just trying to understand and learn more from an expert.

3 hours ago, Legal Eagle said:

It's  a door threshold strip and, as I said, injurious contact is highly unlikely to occur. For the length of time they have been fitted, if it were dangerous for bare feet we would have known about it by now. It only happened in this case through cleaning, not being stepped on. Judging by the responses on this thread no one with the same threshold strip has even noticed it up until now, let alone been injured, so proving any negligence in a duty of care would be impossible. In other words, with only one reported, relatively minor, injury from the thousands of threshold strips fitted how do you satisfy a Court there is a serious risk of injury or even a design fault?

You can give your knee a nasty knock, or  small child can bang their head, on the square edge of a wooden coffee table. I don't think anyone would think twice about that being negligence in a duty of care or a design fault.

Thanks L.E. informative as always, appreciated.

 

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