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Sky dish in france


bobk
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20 hours ago, ascsbe said:

A question for Vin Blanc. On this Australian Link it shows the gadget you suggest in the middle of the dish. What do you think of this?

 

I think that it is an ideal place to position it provided that you have originally checked and confirmed that the reading (when mounted) always conforms exactly with the elevation reading quoted by Dishpointer.com for a particular satellite from a given geographical location.

 

So why would I rule it out immediately? 

Because, the magnetic based inclinometer will only adhere to a steel dish!

 

The dish shown in the picture must weigh about half a ton (Lol), something I would never dream of carting around the continent in a caravan or camping trailer.

 

For mobile use, I always used either a 57cm “Cassegrain” aluminium dish or an 85cm “Offset” plastic dish, both of which were very light in weight but obviously incapable of magnetically supporting any form of magnetic meter on the front. 

 

Vin Blanc 

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54 minutes ago, Vin Blanc said:

I think that it is an ideal place to position it provided that you have originally checked and confirmed that the reading (when mounted) always conforms exactly with the elevation reading quoted by Dishpointer.com for a particular satellite from a given geographical location.

 

So why would I rule it out immediately? 

Because, the magnetic based inclinometer will only adhere to a steel dish!

 

The dish shown in the picture must weigh about half a ton (Lol), something I would never dream of carting around the continent in a caravan or camping trailer.

 

For mobile use, I always used either a 57cm “Cassegrain” aluminium dish or an 85cm “Offset” plastic dish, both of which were very light in weight but obviously incapable of magnetically supporting any form of magnetic meter on the front. 

 

Vin Blanc 

Well my Inclinometer will attach itself to the dish  itself like the picture above. Beyond that these gadgets totally confuse me.  I live in Wimborne  and  without checking I think our elevation is 25.8.  If I attach this device to the front of the dish I have not got a clue what I am looking for. Any help in very straightforward lingo would be appreciated.

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On 26/02/2019 at 09:41, bobk said:

Hi , new to the forum so go easy on me pls .

 

Anyway does anyone have experience using the 80cm perforated sky dish in france , I cannot see a reason why it shouldn't work but I  would like some help .

 

Many thanks bob .

 

Sadly not 80cm. The smaller Zone 1 Sky dish is the equivalent of a 43cm ovoid, the Zone 2 (larger) is the equivalent of a 55cm ovoid.

As you have read here a 60cm ovoid is plenty big enough for most of France and you can buy such a dish complete with LNB and 10m of cable for about €35 in any DIY shed over there. You can get a lightweight tripod by Konig on eBay or just buy a worklight tripod without the lights (again in France) for about €12. The only advice I would give is to take 4x 5mm and 4x 6mm wingnuts with you - it makes attaching the clamp onto the tripod much easier. You will also need some tent pegs to make sure it does not tip over.

For sat location, if you have an Android smartphone download SatDirector and use that. It will use your GPS and compass to give you the right direction, and uses your camera to show you on the screen where it sits in the sky - so you can aim the dish to miss buildings and trees.

Have a look at www.lyngsat.com and Astra 2F at 28E and you will see the footprint. It shows that you will get a signal in most of northern and SE France, but the further south and west you go your chances decrease. Don't use a Sky box to align the dish as (1) they are very slow to respond to signal change and (2) they are notoriously deaf. 

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2 hours ago, ascsbe said:

You are correct but after years of setting up satellite systems I can normally spot the problems before trying to set up. Have not been beaten yet although before I got an SF500 sat finder I did spend quite a while wondering why I could not get picture only to find I was on the wrong satellite. 

 

Yes the SF500 is a great bit of kit for caravan satellite tv.

Got The chinglish version on eBay for £30+

Used the excellent thread here to input the 28.2 parameters it’s great especially in battery power mode as you can set up the dish/LNB absolutely spot on quality and signal strength wise and then cable up.

We must use the satellite system on the West coast as we are not interested in the BBC s Irish offerings.

 

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Hi Ancell & ascsbe,  loved your recent satellite related stories, thought I'd better put mine into print.  Hope you like it!

 

Many years ago we took the caravan down to a site at West Bay, Dorset.

 

Parked up the car and van, connected all services to the van, SWAMBO poured a glass of vino and we settled down to enjoy the view thinking “only the sat dish left to set up and aim then we can think about dinner!”.

 

As most of you must be aware by now, I use an Inclinometer to set the elevation and a Marine compass Gismo to set the Azimuth.

 

Before leaving home I had already been on to Dishpointer .com and written down the elevation, azimuth and skew details for our site at West Bay.

 

After a second glass of the “red nectar” I decided to set up and aim the dish.  I quickly mounted the dish on the tripod and connected the cables into the van.

 

Grabbing my Inclinometer and Marine compass Gismo I quickly aimed the dish at Astra 2.

 

Brimming with confidence (and red nectar) I swaggered back into the van and switched on the PVR and TV…………………………NOTHING!

 

No panic, probably just a bad connection.

 

Check all the connections and try again…………..……………NOTHING!

 

Check the PVR and remote controls …………………………….NOTHING!

 

This can’t be happening, I’m supposed to be an expert on satellite in caravans.               

 

SWAMBO – Dinner is served  -  Oh S..t !  not already, I wanted to watch the news!

 

The meal was delicious (as always) but I don’t notice, I’m too busy staring out of the van at my beautiful “Cassegrain” type  sat dish, brought into vivid focus by our gleaming white 4 x 4 parked a couple of yards behind it!

 

Oh my giddy aunt!...........Oh S..t and corruption! …………It’s all SWAMBO’s fault…………pouring me all that red wine before dinner!

 

I’ve erected the dish within a couple of yards of the parked car which obviously has seriously affected the compass readings!

 

At 9pm I grab the car keys and drive it 50 yards away to the site car park,…………….I then frantically dig out the Marine compass Gismo and re-adjust the Azimuth setting to the same reading but which, this time, leaves the dish pointing several degrees further to the left.

 

9.03 pm, I dash back to the van and turn on the PVR and TV………………..PERFECT PICTURE!

 

So there must be a god after all! 

 

SWAMBO pours me a Baileys & Vodka, I manage to watch only 10 mins of TV and I go out like a light.

 

Here endeth the lesson!  - Never use a compass close to a car or other large metallic vehicle! 

 

Vin Blanc

 

Edited by Vin Blanc
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Nice story. I could tell you so many as well. Many a simple mistake has cost me hours. But all good fun and very rewarding when it all comes together.

Good to have people on this forum who know a lot more than me. Though on the campsite in France I am regarded as something of an expert. Some even told others I work for SKY!!!!!

Andrew

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4 hours ago, ancell said:

 

after you get it all working a motorhome might park next to you-picture gone!

The joys of caravanning satellite tv😂

noooooo dont say that,id be forced to let his tyres down,lol

 

anyway iv just treat myself a primesat 700,looking forward to practising in the garden at the weekend

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2 minutes ago, chris76 said:

noooooo dont say that,id be forced to let his tyres down,lol

 

anyway iv just treat myself a primesat 700,looking forward to practising in the garden at the weekend

 

Possible, yes, but the reality is the beam in France will be coming down quite steeply, at about 1:2.

So even with a dish right on the ground as long as it is twice as far away as the offending thing is high, it will not obstruct. Then most have dishes mounted up off the ground on a tripod, etc, so with local things like vans M/Hs and hedges it can work even closer.

This rule of thumb is IMO useful in judging the impact of trees.

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A couple of cricket mad women were determined to watch their big match on their satellite tv three pitches from us on Kintyre.

Oblivious to the mounting tension The Wife and I began our lunch overlooking Ireland on a glorious day.

We were interrupted by one of our totally stressed out neighbours “we cannot get a picture the crickets started!!!”

Of to their caravan to be met with “we ere getting 80% signal strength why no picture?”

”you are only getting 40% quality!” Sez I.

A couple of minutes tilting the dish produced 80% quality.

Picture appeared-job done.

Wind blew it over that night😀

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Last year, on our way home in France we stopped at a site in Salbris for 1 night. Found a lovely pitch facing the lake and put the steadies down, after setting everything up I pulled out the satellite dish and proceded to set it up. The guy next to me came over and said to me "you won't get a signal here, I've been here a week and gave up". I told him it had worked fine in the Dordogne so there is no reason why it shouldn't work here. within 3 minutes the TV was showing a picture with sound. After about 5 minutes I could hear this man's wife having a go at him saying something like, that man next door has his TV set up in no time and I have missed Coronation Street for a week. I just sat there drinking wine and watching the ducks going by.   :D

 

Bailey Pageant Series 6 Champagne 2007    Tow Car Toyota Rav4

 

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Surely if you are desperate to watch a few UK channels, would it not be easier to set up a VPN as you can then watch UK programs anywhere on the continent?

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14 hours ago, chris76 said:

noooooo dont say that,id be forced to let his tyres down,lol

 

anyway iv just treat myself a primesat 700,looking forward to practising in the garden at the weekend

 

An Irish wolfhound lifted his leg on our sats  LNB It had the effect of cutting Hamilton off in the last lap with his tyres going off😀.

I would have tried to get the owner to clean and dry the LNB but the dog was-of course-on it’s own😂

I now use a sat tripod and watch out for stallions😀

Tripod cost £20 on fleabay held down with metal tent pegs plus bungee pegged on back of dish mid point.So far it has survived the Kintyre gales.

Thats an excellent idea of practicing at home.

You can find D-I-Y bits that work.

Simplify your kit-impossible for gadget fans like me.

Get used to fine tuning the gear eg rotating the LNB(skew)can mean the difference between getting a picture or not if using a small dish at Thurso.

1 hour ago, Durbanite said:

Surely if you are desperate to watch a few UK channels, would it not be easier to set up a VPN as you can then watch UK programs anywhere on the continent?

 

I use Tunnel Bear.

I was on Majorca last spring fired up Tunnel Bear on the iPad Air to be informed by iPlayer I was not in the UK😀

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I use my 80 cm maxview crank up on the roof of my motorhome and my Satlink ws 6908 and the app saterllite director for direction I can just just connect it to the lead and it takes about 30 secs to a minute to set up . If I stop in a laybye or motorway services for half an hour for a cuppa and want to watch some sky TV I want it quick and easy to set up .

 

 

 

Dave

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21 hours ago, ascsbe said:

Well my Inclinometer will attach itself to the dish  itself like the picture above. Beyond that these gadgets totally confuse me.  I live in Wimborne  and  without checking I think our elevation is 25.8.  If I attach this device to the front of the dish I have not got a clue what I am looking for. Any help in very straightforward lingo would be appreciated.

 

Think of your dish as a laser gun. Now imagine that you are aiming it at the satellite using the crosshairs of a telescopic sight.

 

Where the hairs cross in the middle is where the satellite you are aiming at (Astra 2) needs to be, but you can’t see it because it’s 24000 miles away.

 

Tilting the dish effects the elevation setting, so tilt it until the needle on the anglefinder  points to 25.8° then lock it down. Now you only need to concentrate on the Azimuth (or lateral positioning).

 

For this, you first need to point the dish (as well you can) to exactly South West. If that is difficult I know a simple way to do it.

 

This is your starting position, because as you then begin to swing the dish very slowly further towards South, the satfinder should start to squeal louder and louder until it is at its maximum.

 

Astra 2 (freesat & Sky) should be the first satellite that you start to pick up!

 

Lock down the position, check your strength and quality readings (remember quality is the important one) and go see if you’ve got a picture.  If you haven’t, get back to me.

 

BTW, I have always left the skew position on my mobile dishes set half way between 6 & 7 o'clock, in all my travels I have never had cause to reset the skew. 

 

Vin Blanc

 

Edited by Vin Blanc
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Many thanks.

Andrew

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3 hours ago, Vin Blanc said:

 

Think of your dish as a laser gun. Now imagine that you are aiming it at the satellite using the crosshairs of a telescopic sight.

 

Where the hairs cross in the middle is where the satellite you are aiming at (Astra 2) needs to be, but you can’t see it because it’s 24000 miles away.

 

Tilting the dish effects the elevation setting, so tilt it until the needle on the anglefinder  points to 25.8° then lock it down. Now you only need to concentrate on the Azimuth (or lateral positioning).

 

For this, you first need to point the dish (as well you can) to exactly South West. If that is difficult I know a simple way to do it.

 

This is your starting position, because as you then begin to swing the dish very slowly further towards South, the satfinder should start to squeal louder and louder until it is at its maximum.

 

Astra 2 (freesat & Sky) should be the first satellite that you start to pick up!

 

Lock down the position, check your strength and quality readings (remember quality is the important one) and go see if you’ve got a picture.  If you haven’t, get back to me.

 

BTW, I have always left the skew position on my mobile dishes set half way between 6 & 7 o'clock, in all my travels I have never had cause to reset the skew. 

 

Vin Blanc

 

👍

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I think VB means South East rather than South West.

Graham

Unless otherwise stated all posts are my personal opinion 

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Thanks WispMan, you are correct, I meant South East - it's an age thing!

Vin Blanc

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Hi ascsbe,  I assume that you will probably be trying out this method of aiming your steel dish at home in Wimbourne using your dish elevation setting of 25.8° . 

 

I would be very interested to hear how you get on partly because I live just down the road from you in New Milton and my elevation setting is 25.4°.   

 

If you manage to get a picture OK, please check your Astra 2 strength and quality readings and advise the results for comparison.

 

My aluminium 40cm offset house dish for Astra 2 (Freesat) - 80% strength 100% quality.

 

Vin Blanc

 

Aso thought this may help.

 

 59969473_DishwithInclinometer(500x333).jpg.c936f6f7af3a29c90e64f82c0823e2ed.jpg 

Edited by Vin Blanc
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When I rechecked on Dish pointer we are 25.3.  Long time since I set up at home so had forgotten. .   We have just upgraded at home to Skyq and the readings that sky got when they renewed my dish and wiring was 75 Strength 90 quality. We have a fairly long cable and the engineer calculated the loss of signal but it was negligible. 

I will be setting up my touring dish in the next week or two and will let you know the outcome. 

Andrew

 

Vin Blanc

Thanks for the graph. I use to have my Inclinometer on a bracket on a previous set up and think I will reset that up rather than use tha Aussie video method. 

Andrew

Edited by ascsbe
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Hi again ascsbe,

I woke up at 2am last night and found myself thinking about the angle finder mounted vertically on the front of the dish in the Aussie video.

 

Suddenly, a thought flashed into my aged brain that just hadn’t occurred to me previously, (or anyone else apparently ‘cos no one has mentioned it so far).

 

When the angle finder is mounted vertically at the front of the dish, any elevation figure quoted by “Dishpointer.com” cannot be used.

 

To achieve the correct setting on the angle finder you will always need to add 90° to the quoted figure thus giving you a setting on your angle finder of 115.3° for your location in Wimbourne.

 

I’m sure I’m right, can anyone else clarify?

 

Vin Blanc

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IMO the physical angle of  the dish itself is not relevant as it is the "off set" that counts with respect to where it is "looking", not the dish shape or styling profile.

So if using a clino you have first to determine  the characteristics of your dish, relative to the way you place the clino on the dish.

So lets assume, for example it is convenient to place the clino centrally on a 2" x 1" wood batten placed vertically top to bottom and abutting the left flank of the arm.

If you do that on an already aligned dish  at a location where you know the beam angle you can read the difference in the clino's reading to the dishes "true" angle of sight. Then knowing that variance with a bit of basic arithmetic you can set the dish up anywhere else where you know the elevation for that spot.

Personally, I would on doing that original dish to clino datum test simply make a wood bracket up to the correcting angle so the clino reads the true line of sight directly.

 

Being really honest I would and have purchased a dish featuring a high quality angle scale and setting quadrant, so that starts at very close to the required angle. Then use a tripod that allows micro tilting  each way to fine tune whilst setting with the "finder" plus Easy Find. I would not clutter life up carrying a clino and the purpose made setting up beam/bracket, but then I fight clutter that seems to be so attracted to this hobby.

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Hi ascsbe, it’s me again!

 

I have spent the morning crawling around my loft and finally found my old angle finder (same as the one in the Aussie video).

 

I was able to simulate mounting the angle finder in a vertical position as shown in the Aussie video and here are my final conclusions.

 

I was able to confirm my earlier suspicion that 90° would have to be added to any elevation figure quoted by dishpointer.com. as I had assumed from memory that the dial of the angle finder would show 0° to 359° however, it appears that this is not the case!

 

In reality, the angle finder is divided into 4 sections of 90°, each numbered 0 to 90. As soon as you reach 90 the numbers start to go backwards from 80 70 60 50 and so on down.

 

So I just wouldn’t dream of following the Australian idea – no way!  Stick with your tried and tested rear mounted bracket and good luck!.

 

Vin Blanc    

Edited by Vin Blanc
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Thanks for that and yes I will stick to tried and trusted method. It was just that when I saw the Aussie just slap it on the dish I thought Blimey that looks easy. Now I think differently. Anyway got people thinking about it. 

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On 02/03/2019 at 12:28, Vin Blanc said:

Hi again ascsbe,

I woke up at 2am last night and found myself thinking about the angle finder mounted vertically on the front of the dish in the Aussie video.

 

Suddenly, a thought flashed into my aged brain that just hadn’t occurred to me previously, (or anyone else apparently ‘cos no one has mentioned it so far).

 

When the angle finder is mounted vertically at the front of the dish, any elevation figure quoted by “Dishpointer.com” cannot be used.

 

To achieve the correct setting on the angle finder you will always need to add 90° to the quoted figure thus giving you a setting on your angle finder of 115.3° for your location in Wimbourne.

 

I’m sure I’m right, can anyone else clarify?

 

Vin Blanc

 

Glad someone is keeping us right-day and night😂😂

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