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Brake squeaks & squealing 2017/18 ALKO Axle

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1 hour ago, lowedb said:

OK, but not sure what industry. In the automotive industry 'locking the brakes' means stopping the wheels turning as in anti lock brakes / ABS (OK technically anti blockier system). Personally I'm convinced it's down at the brake drum / shoe level.

 

Not quite right, if you " lock the brakes " this suggests that with maximum pedal pressure and dependant on tyre composition, road surface, speed etc. that the brakes effectively stop the wheels turning at all, inducing a skid and all the consequent results of being unable to steer etc

 

ABS  still allows maximum pedal pressure to be applied, however at the point where a wheel starts to skid the system releases and re- applies maximum pressure at that wheel / wheels, selective cadence braking, hence the rapid pulsating felt at the brake pedal and consequent noise.

 

Maximum retardation under any conditions, is obtained at the point where  traction is about to be lost, ABS allows some semblance of steering to take place.

 

Oddly enough, depending  on conditions and driver, a car without ABS can stop in a shorter distance than one with ABS.

 

I was always amazed, and still am ( though long retired )  when panic sets in when the ABS light comes on, denoting that ABS is no longer effective, yes it is for whatever reason, but the brakes are still OK.

 

I'm convinced it's down at the brake drum / shoe level.

 

I agree drum, shoe, operating system, of which a caravan system is more complex than a car  etc.   all have a roll to play, I'll post a bit more tomorrow after the Carbernet Sauvignon has worn off. 😅

Edited by Silversurf

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19 hours ago, Silversurf said:

 

Not quite right, if you " lock the brakes " this suggests that with maximum pedal pressure and dependant on tyre composition, road surface, speed etc. that the brakes effectively stop the wheels turning at all, inducing a skid and all the consequent results of being unable to steer etc

 

Yes that's what I was saying, and that ABS prevents locking the wheels. But I can see that isn't clear the way I wrote it. But it is clear that I mention locking the wheels causes skidding. So we are agreeing.  

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The 30/9/18 Update.

Just returned from a repeat 400 mile towing trip through Leics &  into Norfolk with a Lincs return so lots and lots of roundabouts slowing & braking . Total of 3 trips and towed 600 miles since brake rebuild number 2 (new drums, modified shoes and the superlube).

Can report, now 600 miles towed, all is quiet so far so very hopeful its sorted.

Seems the MK2 repair is more succesful as per Alko bulletin update & other comments.

Assume Alko will be getting all the known Caravan stock at Dealers or with owners recalled or modified - ha ha ha.

Good luck with yours !

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On 26/09/2018 at 20:09, Jacko1 said:

Lowebd, perhaps didn't explain my terminology properly.  Was using a bit of industry parlance. .

when I say locked I didn't actually mean locking the wheels so much they stop turning and skid. What should have said was that as you increase pressure on the shoes they reduce any gap between shoe and drum hence removing any potential harmonic gap. As you rightly say when stationary there will be no noise or vibration.

and yes you may have a point and something axle wise may be the source, that's were I would start and also at the shock absorption components.

i assume manufacturers such as Alko would have thought of this.

 

dealer rang me earlier and told me they have replaced shoes with latest Alko offerings and also changed the drums. Collecting it tomorrow so let's see👍

I agree with your train of thought Jacko1, guess being an engineer of sorts myself. My 580 as been in twice now and still no further forward. Last response was they had followed all the steps that ALKO had recommended to them which it seems included making groves in the pads but nothing changed. I will be interested to see how you now get on but I'm now looking to have the van booked in for a 3rd time. Don't get me wrong I can live with the odd squeal from time to time but this is loud and all the time, like you say at low speed and with little pressure on the brake pedal.  

Edited by Flyingiceman

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Sorry to come late to the party but I thought I would share my experience with the Alko brakes.

Long story short, van in for annual service, first the good news, habitation OK, new 5 year antifreeze OK, but now the bad news - o/s wheel bearing collapsing, n/s brake pads have come off their base wrecking the hub.   And this is on a 2 year old Valencia.  

I reported brake squealing at my first service to my dealer and they said they were OK but they kept making a noise.

So this year I have taken it to a NCC approved workshop, and they are hoping that Alko will replace the bearing under warranty but have doubts about them replacing the brake pads and hub under warranty. So this could end up costing me near £300! I am not best pleased about this as you can imagine.

I have also told them about this thread so they are emailing Alko to see what they are prepared to do about this.

I will keep the forum posted about the result.

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I guess you mean brake shoes? They don't have disc brakes.

 

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Hi all

 

just to update you on my earlier post on the squeaking brakes on our coachman. After many arguements and a formal complaint the dealer got permission off alko to chnage the shoes and drums. They did this and whilst not perfect it is better than it was. As with everyone who have posted it appears that the gentle press of the brakes causes the squeak rather than full on braking. We have an agreemnt to inform the dealer after a few months of travelling but as it costs me 1/2 day in annual leave every time i take it to them i dont have that many holiday days left at work to enjoy the van.

 

good luck to all who have had issues - my advice is to make the delaler  do their work - the product is not fit for purpose (original drums and shoes) which is NOT your fault and whilst they have the right to try and fix it it should be noted that above 3 times for a known problem is not reasonable under the consumer act - make sure you stick at them to replace the faulty units - it costs them and they may think about selling inferior products in the future as recalls cost them money every time they have to sort it.

 

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19 hours ago, Yorkie Daz said:

Hi all

 

just to update you on my earlier post on the squeaking brakes on our coachman. After many arguements and a formal complaint the dealer got permission off alko to chnage the shoes and drums. They did this and whilst not perfect it is better than it was. As with everyone who have posted it appears that the gentle press of the brakes causes the squeak rather than full on braking. We have an agreemnt to inform the dealer after a few months of travelling but as it costs me 1/2 day in annual leave every time i take it to them i dont have that many holiday days left at work to enjoy the van.

 

good luck to all who have had issues - my advice is to make the delaler  do their work - the product is not fit for purpose (original drums and shoes) which is NOT your fault and whilst they have the right to try and fix it it should be noted that above 3 times for a known problem is not reasonable under the consumer act - make sure you stick at them to replace the faulty units - it costs them and they may think about selling inferior products in the future as recalls cost them money every time they have to sort it.

 

 

Allegedly there is now a permanent fix issued by AL-KO to dealers .

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My dealer said they have carried out the fix discribed by ALKO but still no better result. The saga continues I'm afraid at least for me.

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On ‎08‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 16:15, Flyingiceman said:

My dealer said they have carried out the fix discribed by ALKO but still no better result. The saga continues I'm afraid at least for me.

 

My braked are now fine … When did they attempt your fix and what was involved ?

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On ‎31‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 13:00, Islandboy said:

Sorry to come late to the party but I thought I would share my experience with the Alko brakes.

Long story short, van in for annual service, first the good news, habitation OK, new 5 year antifreeze OK, but now the bad news - o/s wheel bearing collapsing, n/s brake pads have come off their base wrecking the hub.   And this is on a 2 year old Valencia.  

I reported brake squealing at my first service to my dealer and they said they were OK but they kept making a noise.

So this year I have taken it to a NCC approved workshop, and they are hoping that Alko will replace the bearing under warranty but have doubts about them replacing the brake pads and hub under warranty. So this could end up costing me near £300! I am not best pleased about this as you can imagine.

I have also told them about this thread so they are emailing Alko to see what they are prepared to do about this.

I will keep the forum posted about the result.

An update:

I have now picked up the van after having the service done. Alko have replaced the wheel hubs and wheel bearings along with the brake shoes on both sides of the axle. All under warranty. Result!

Thanks to this forum I was able to point my service workshop in the right direction re: brake failures etc. , so giving them a bit more information to persuade Alko to replace everything.

Thanks again.

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4 hours ago, Islandboy said:

An update:

I have now picked up the van after having the service done. Alko have replaced the wheel hubs and wheel bearings along with the brake shoes on both sides of the axle. All under warranty. Result!

Thanks to this forum I was able to point my service workshop in the right direction re: brake failures etc. , so giving them a bit more information to persuade Alko to replace everything.

Thanks again.

:)

 

Great result, but should you have had to go through all the heartache, time, expense and worry to get to this point.

 

John

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Islandboy,

Really glad to hear you got it sorted and thanks for post.

Hopefully your van will pass the 500 mile bedding in period now without further issue.

About time the un-biased Caravan & Club Mags wrote a helpful article on this subject - ha ha ha.  

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I am having the same problem with my Elddis Affinity 462 2018 . I have had serviced in March and the brakes recleaned and adjusted by my local NCC approved  workshop in May due to squealing brakes . Went out last weekend and made no  difference so should I contact the dealers given problems that are affecting these Van's 

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Our Swift Conqueror 480 2016 brakes squealed from day one, the dealer looked at them at the first service half way home started squealing again, second year service carried out by Swift approved mobile engineer the brakes were a little better, we are now on the third year service the same Swift approved mobile engineer removed the drum to find deep grooves in the offside brake shoes and drum and advised chasing up a warranty claim.

 

The engineer has supplied a full report and photos, let see what happens, AL-KO shut down  factory the factory in August, my warranty runs out 20th August 2019?

 

 

 

 

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My 2019 Coachman VIP 520 has squealing brakes when lightly applied, and continue after I have released the car brakes, so I am hoping they just need some lubrication on the shoes, if not I have already let the dealer know with photo of the axle label and they are ready to put a claim into Alko.  

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1 hour ago, kiaboy said:

My 2019 Coachman VIP 520 has squealing brakes when lightly applied, and continue after I have released the car brakes, so I am hoping they just need some lubrication on the shoes, if not I have already let the dealer know with photo of the axle label and they are ready to put a claim into Alko.  

It is not lubrication that is needed it needs a complete new brake assembly. My 2019 Vigo was only 3 month old when it started squealing the brake assembly has just been replaced

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23 hours ago, oldboy said:

It is not lubrication that is needed it needs a complete new brake assembly. My 2019 Vigo was only 3 month old when it started squealing the brake assembly has just been replaced

Thanks, but can you confirm if the replacements have cured the problem, I have hear that is hasn't.  I am going to visit a local Alko repairer when I get the chance, and have a chat with them as my dealer is over 3 hours drive away (bought from NEC) and feel the trip is too far just for this. 

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12 hours ago, kiaboy said:

Thanks, but can you confirm if the replacements have cured the problem, I have hear that is hasn't.  I am going to visit a local Alko repairer when I get the chance, and have a chat with them as my dealer is over 3 hours drive away (bought from NEC) and feel the trip is too far just for this. 

Yes no problem so far. apparently when the issue of brake squealing started Alko had a modification in place which did not work so because of the scale of the issue  which affected all make of caravan Alko decided to replace them instead of doing the modification. when you visit the local Alko repairer ask if he can put a warranty claim in otherwise you may have to go back to your dealer.

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1 hour ago, oldboy said:

Yes no problem so far. apparently when the issue of brake squealing started Alko had a modification in place which did not work so because of the scale of the issue  which affected all make of caravan Alko decided to replace them instead of doing the modification. when you visit the local Alko repairer ask if he can put a warranty claim in otherwise you may have to go back to your dealer.

Thanks. That's good news. Will chat with the local chap soon as we go away next week, I have given myself 2 options then 👍

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11 hours ago, oldboy said:

Yes no problem so far. apparently when the issue of brake squealing started Alko had a modification in place which did not work so because of the scale of the issue  which affected all make of caravan Alko decided to replace them instead of doing the modification. when you visit the local Alko repairer ask if he can put a warranty claim in otherwise you may have to go back to your dealer.

My usual,  reliable Mobile AWS guy said he did not want to do the job, as it's really a dealer job and needs to be road tested which is difficult for mobiles to do, so I managed to get over to the local Alko approved repairer, he said at first as I was not one of his regular customers, he did not want to do the work as he was fully booked at the moment with his regular customers, which is fair enough, after a while he had discussing the ins and outs of warranty work, he ended up saying it does not pay to do other dealers work or mobile AWS , but in the end did agree on this instance to  put the claim through. He also said the road test is rubbish, so now I wonder if my "reliable and trust worthy" guy is as he is???? 

any way photo of the axle label and caravan details have been submitted to him. I am now wondering whether to cancel my service this year and move it them and get the brakes done at the same time. But they are £50 more and I have got to take majority of stuff out for them, unlike a mobile guy.. Decisions Decisions :)

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29/7/19 update.

The Alko specified repair carried out in 2018  has now started failing again ( on light braking just as before) 600 miles after our 1st Service and the brakes cleaned & inspected in March 2109.

Re-booked with Dealer 13/8/19 for our 4 th reurn visit - no out of pockets expenses again. 

Parts have arrived again from Alko but just the same ones yet again !

Dealer nearly as irritated as me.

Good luck everyone ! 

 

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I have had this squeaking  problem with my 2016 coachman vision from new, I have taken it to the dealers at least four times probably 6  ,last week the dealer decided to fit new shoe linings ,now it’s even worse ,travel from the dealer to storage aprox 10 mile and the brakes squeaking as before ,when I reached my storage compound I checked the wheels and I could have Fried an egg on them ,both red hot , I phoned the dealer and told them it was worse ,he replied that only me has complained over this issue ,I will ring you back ,he never.  did ,

i sent an email to the dealer and received a reply saying my issue is going through the complaints process and should have a decision within 10days  ,

!!watch this space !!

 

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We had brake squeal on our Coachman VIP 2018 almost from the off and our dealer replaced the whole brake components under warranty at its firs service. During our 6  week tour in France the squeal has come back, not as bad as before but still audible. We will be away again in France towards the end of August and will see if it is still evident - if it is, it will be on the list again at its second service.

Alan 

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ADMIN COMMENT

 

A post by a new member claiming to be an AL-KO employee has been removed.

 

The post make allegations against AL-KO which we have no way of verifying, it could be true it could also be false,  it could be a post from a disgruntled employee.

 

Until we have further verifiable information the post will remain hidden.

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