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swaggy

SOG System

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I have  seen a  "SOG ventilation system" for the caravan toilet on a mate's motorhome. .    It provides  passive  external ventilation for the cassette as well as running a fan when the blade is opened to provide negative pressure to the bowl area which, it is claimed, eliminates any odours.   It is also stated that as no chemicals at all are used in the cassette  then the waste is more environmentally friendly for disposal where a chemical  point is not available.    I have a C200  manual flush but variants are available for many different types of toilet.

Has anyone had experience of such a system?  I'd be interested in your comments.

 

 

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I had the misfortune to be pitched next to someone that had a sog system. One evening when the wind direction changed the stench was awful, i have also witnessed the pong when the cassette is being emptied. at least with the blue or green fluids in the cassette the smell is controlled.

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We have a SOG system fitted to our current and previous caravan. I fitted the original kit to our last caravan which we used for over 1000 nights in Spain, and then   transferred the same kit to our new caravan 2 years ago. A few spares have been needed and easily available, filters are replaced annually and this has been no problem. We bought it in the first place because we hate the smell of toilet chemicals, and fail to see why we should need to use them in the caravan when we don't need them in the home (and yet its nearly always the same type of sewage system). We think toilet chemicals are simply a money making scam - some are dangerous to health, and accumulatively add to the pollution of our eco systems. We've been delighted with the performance of the SOG, having never ever once had any odour in the toilet compartment. The carbon filter ensures there is no discernable smell outside where the air is vented  (I haven't tried  kneeling down and sniffing the vent, but then why would I ?)  Emptying the cassette involves exactly the same technique as usual so if you splash it about there will be a smell.

The process of dissolving the waste inside the cassette is simply no different to a cassette using chemicals, except that by ventilating the air space above the fluid level in the cassette this natural process is accelerated. The idea that chemicals dissolve the waste is nonsense. Chemicals simply disguise the smell.  

Using the toilet is no different to any other caravan toilet. the fan switches on instantly as the shutter is opened and stops immediately as its closed. The vacuum created in the cassette pulls foul air from the toilet pan.

Environmentally, the SOG system is much kinder. You can empty the cassette in any sewage system.  

There are negative opinions expressed about the SOG system,  usually spoken by people who haven't used one.

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9 hours ago, swaggy said:

I have  seen a  "SOG ventilation system" for the caravan toilet on a mate's motorhome. .    It provides  passive  external ventilation for the cassette as well as running a fan when the blade is opened to provide negative pressure to the bowl area which, it is claimed, eliminates any odours.   It is also stated that as no chemicals at all are used in the cassette  then the waste is more environmentally friendly for disposal where a chemical  point is not available.    I have a C200  manual flush but variants are available for many different types of toilet.

Has anyone had experience of such a system?  I'd be interested in your comments.

 

 

Caravans fitted with the Dometiq toilet get part of SOG as standard - as the cassette is refitted, a valve on top connects with a hose, visible when the cassette is removed, and that hose remains open to atmosphere to rid the cassette of noxious gases - unlike a full SOG system, there's no fan operating when the cassette blade is opened.

We have such a Dometiq toilet in our 2013 Lunar but their later models may have switched back to Thetford. We use plain water in the flush and just cheap supermarket biological washing liquid - it works well enough for us and cause no issues at any sort of disposal point.

If you demand complete suppression of all toilet gases, then you have no choice but use environmentally-unfriendly products, just to get the high levels of "perfume"

Edited by Black Grouse
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12 minutes ago, Black Grouse said:

Caravans fitted with the Dometiq toilet get part of SOG as standard - as the cassette is refitted, a valve on top connects with a hose, visible when the cassette is removed, and that hose remains open to atmosphere to rid the cassette of noxious gases - unlike a full SOG system, there's no fan operating when the cassette blade is opened.

Didn't know that even though I have (and have had) this type albeit with flush water from onboard tank.   Is the hose gas filtered in any way?

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We fitted a SOG to our last three caravans and thought the system was great. No smells at all either inside or by the toilet compartment outside. I can only think that the one AJGalaxy experienced didn't have a carbom filter fitted.

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15 minutes ago, SamD said:

Didn't know that even though I have (and have had) this type albeit with flush water from onboard tank.   Is the hose gas filtered in any way?

Mine isn't - I have thought about adding a carbon filter in a plastic project box but I do have higher priority "improvements" on my list - and less inclination to do any of them as I get older!

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My loo has a facility for adding this type of "fresh air" system. Might think about it in future.

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The chemicals used in a toilet actually preserve the contents of the tank (formaldehyde) to stop it breaking down and causing the stench.

you guys with the sog’s are welcome to them, especially when emptying the raw sewage.  I accept there’s no smell inside but just like any sewer pipe vented to the outside there’s going to be a smell, good if the carbon filter eliminates it.

aj

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26 minutes ago, AJGalaxy2012 said:

The chemicals used in a toilet actually preserve the contents of the tank (formaldehyde) to stop it breaking down and causing the stench.

you guys with the sog’s are welcome to them, especially when emptying the raw sewage.  I accept there’s no smell inside but just like any sewer pipe vented to the outside there’s going to be a smell, good if the carbon filter eliminates it.

aj

Formaldehyde has largely been eliminated from chemical toilet products and banned on many sites as it interferes with the natural processes that make sewage systems work. Formaldehyde is also known to cause cancer - use it at your own risk!

But "you're alright Jack!"

Edited by Black Grouse
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44 minutes ago, Black Grouse said:

Formaldehyde has largely been eliminated from chemical toilet products and banned on many sites as it interferes with the natural processes that make sewage systems work. Formaldehyde is also known to cause cancer - use it at your own risk!

But "you're alright Jack!"

However it was effective in negating the smell.   We think we still use the old Elsan blue with the formaldehyde as you can buy it in 4litre bottles for under a tenner instead of the silly prices they want for the "Green" stuff.   If the "Green" stuff was more user friendly and at a more reasonable price then we would certainly consider using it.

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49 minutes ago, Black Grouse said:

Formaldehyde has largely been eliminated from chemical toilet products and banned on many sites as it interferes with the natural processes that make sewage systems work. Formaldehyde is also known to cause cancer - use it at your own risk!

But "you're alright Jack!"

I think that’s a bit uncalled for. ...

 

in reply, diesel exhaust also causes cancer and I suppose you wouldn’t do such a selfish thing would you?

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Maybe some people do under estamate the process of a Carbon filter or activated carbon . Carbon used as a proces to eliminate smell and chemicals . like copper chlorine etc have a loading capacity. just like the water filter used inline on caravans. and fish taks alike. When carbon is full to capacity with detrious it leaches its entire contents back out. essentially fouling what ever it is being used for. So this is the reason for it to be replaced at regular intervals to stop the leaching. A example is that of a fish tank . people think its there as a mechanical filter and keeps the water clean. no. if you have ever noticed that all of a sudden 1 day your tank looks really dirty from overnight. this is when the carbon cannot contain its self any more so releases it contents back into the water in a explotion. and this is the same with SOG and the water filter in you inline system. Hence the requirment to change it regularly. May be this is what happened to AJG.

Moreso the requirement to change your water filter as the start of the season.

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1 hour ago, Black Grouse said:

Formaldehyde has largely been eliminated from chemical toilet products and banned on many sites.

Still in Eleanor Blue 10 to 20% and I haven’t seen it banned anywhere.

BP01%20TOILET%20FLUIDS%20(BLUE%20%20PINK

 

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Our 2008 Adrial Coral Compact motorhome had a Thetford C250 loo that had a charcoal filled replaceable cardboard filter box in its base with a hole on top and one on the bottom that matched a hole in the base so air expelled under the van. A fan operated when you pressed the flush button and ran for a few minutes afterwards. Adria still suggested that a chemical should be used and the usual small bottle of Thetford stuff was included. So it would seem that Thetford can supply a toilet that has a sort of SOG system built in.

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26 minutes ago, AJGalaxy2012 said:

I think that’s a bit uncalled for. ...

 

in reply, diesel exhaust also causes cancer and I suppose you wouldn’t do such a selfish thing would you?

All my diesels have had a DPF - I wouldn't switch from petrol until they did.

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3 hours ago, Ern said:

we hate the smell of toilet chemicals, and fail to see why we should need to use them in the caravan when we don't need them in the home (and yet its nearly always the same type of sewage system).

I am not sure I can agree with this comment.

Notwithstanding the features of a SOG system

Most if not all household sewage systems remove the waste from the home into either the sewer for onward transmission to the water tratment plant, or into a septic tank away from the bathroom.

Caravans have a small cassette which stores the waste directly below the bowl until such time as you empty it. If left without chemicals it will start to decompose which adds to the smell.

 

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A major part of the smell issue is the frequency of emptying of the cassette in conjunction with its temperature.

Some people empty the cassette daily, regardless of whether or not it is full, others will wait as long as they dare. An SOG cassette, used for all toilet waste, without chemicals, only emptied every 5 days under warm conditions will have a distinctly organic smell!  A cassette overdosed with chemicals and emptied frequently will have a distinct chemical smell.

Personally, I am not keen on either smell!

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42 minutes ago, AJGalaxy2012 said:

Still in Eleanor Blue 10 to 20% and I haven’t seen it banned anywhere.

BP01%20TOILET%20FLUIDS%20(BLUE%20%20PINK

 

In agriculture we have been banned from using it for the last 25+ years, highly toxic chemical especially when inhaled! Avoid it at all costs!

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This thread has made me wonder.

Our store n stay site has signs all over saying green fluid must be used to preserve the operation of their sewage plant. It doesn't say blue mustn't be used. It doesn't say it's OK to use nothing at all, or washing detergent, just 'you must use green'. I realise they don't want blue used but I wonder what their view would be on the other two possibles i.e detergent or nothing at all?  

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As far as I know  green fluids don't contain formaldehyde.    Some land owners who have septic tanks and other types of disposal other than sewers mustn't have formaldehyde put in their holding tanks - hence the warning notices.

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2 minutes ago, Jaydug said:

As far as I know  green fluids don't contain formaldehyde.    Some land owners who have septic tanks and other types of disposal other than sewers mustn't have formaldehyde put in their holding tanks - hence the warning notices.

Agreed - but even when disposed of into a mains sewage system, the formaldehyde slows down the decomposition - as a proportion the formaldehyde is small but still increases the sewage cost element of domestic water rates.

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4 minutes ago, Black Grouse said:

 as a proportion the formaldehyde is small but still increases the sewage cost element of domestic water rates.

I'm sure it does.    A couple of years ago the chief technical officer of our local water board wrote an article for our Residents' Association magazine.     Amongst the substances they found in the treatment works were battery acid and used engine oil.     Also the detergent content of the rain water run off was so high that they inspected every property and gave notice of prosecution  to householders who had directed their washing machine outlet into the rain-water gulleys.  

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18 minutes ago, Steamdrivenandy said:

This thread has made me wonder.

Our store n stay site has signs all over saying green fluid must be used to preserve the operation of their sewage plant. It doesn't say blue mustn't be used. It doesn't say it's OK to use nothing at all, or washing detergent, just 'you must use green'. I realise they don't want blue used but I wonder what their view would be on the other two possibles i.e detergent or nothing at all?  

I think the meaning of green is in a environmentally friendly sense rather than the colour,  I use Elson blue on most sites however if they ask for green chemicals I use Fenwicks citric fresh, its in the green class even though its coloured blue :rolleyes:

The use of bio tabs can also effect the working of a septic tank unless they use the eco friendly type, and as far as the sog system goes, I think I've been unlucky as the carbon filters on the ones I've been parked next haven't worked very well :(  I also wont go near a Elson point if someone is there first, just-in-case.

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In another light, we dont have a header tank for the toilet. It runs direct of the fresh water. So no top chemical is used. however we do use a fragrence for the cassette part. but my question with regards hygene is. The fresh water is on a tee from the main to the shower and bathroom sink. when you flush it, it draws from the aqua roll pump. so when not being flushed and you turn on the shower or sink there is a provision for the still water in the pipe from the jet in the systern to back flow in the main water stream.

If like the central heating of a house there is a law that the heating side conector is to be removed from the boiler to stop/prevent any water coming out of the heating and into the main stream . So i fitted a non return valve inline to the toilet.

I brought this up with Elddis, yet it fell on deaf ears.

Edited by smino0_1

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