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Stevecol

Hot water in aqua roll?

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Hi all,

Apologies if this seems a stupid question.

We've had our caravan 12 months now and the only real irritation has been the the shower not lasting long enough for my wife. She tries the on/off approach but it still doesn' last long enough.

I was just wondering if I put hot water in the aqua roll (not boiling) would it extend the duration of a hot shower?

My initial concern is damage to seals etc but I'd love to get people's opinions.

Thanks 

Steve 

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Probably not a good idea as the hot water will have to flow through the pump and they aren't designed to either sit in hot water(if it's external and sitting in the aquaroll) or pump it if it's internal.

I suppose it wouldn't be much of a problem to pour a kettleful of hot into a nearly full aquaroll to take the chill off the water but I wouldn't recommend filling it with hot (if you could get a sufficient quantity anyway).

Dunno what sort of water heater you've got but we've never had a problem running out of hot water.

 

You could try one of these https://www. amazon. co. uk/Adjustable-Shower-Brilliant-Saving-Perfect/dp/B009W2MW9Y/ref=sr_1_1/259-7468333-9224069?ie=UTF8&qid=1513360782&sr=8-1&keywords=shower+head+with+on%2Foff+switch

 

Edited by matelodave

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Point one is the Aquaroll can't be made hotter than the safe temperature for a shower as it is the only cooling water source; that safe temperature is 42 or 43  C [depends on quoted authority], however, it is low enough that system damage will IMO not occur at all.

Yes, it will extend things but it depends on the temperature you can raise it to. If you got it up to 43 C then you would probably be talking about twice or a tad longer.

Seems a challenge too far for me, really shower discipline is the "right" route but I know in these matters taking on the difficult job can be the least "trouble".

Edited by JTQ

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Do you actually have the hot water set to its highest temperature? Ours has two settings, one would be comfortable for a shower, but the shower would be too short, the higher setting is much too hot, but if mixed with cold to bring it to a useable temperature lasts adequately long.   We also have an eco-camel head which makes it feel like much more water by adding air.

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If the problem is a shortage of hot water then you can run the water heater on gas and electricity at the same time. ISTR that it takes about 15min to heat 10L from cold by this method so it should work. Just make sure the barrel is full before you start as running out of water will not do it any good!

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You haven't told us what water heating system you have or how you have it set or on what fuel.  You need to be a bit more precise if you want some good responses as we need to understand whether you're using the water heater to its best or whether you've got something wrong with it. As far as I know, all modern caravans have a water heating system capable of giving 2 adults a reasonable shower if they are working correctly and used correctly.  

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Thanks for all the replies. We bought a Sprite Major 6td which has the truma combi 6 I believe. On the digital control I set it to boost and on mix 2 which is supposed to be 60 degrees heated by gas and electricity. I've never tried the shower as I'm 6ft 6 and 17st (really not designed for me☺) but she's told me it only lasts a couple of minutes. We've got the eco camel shower head fitted as standard.

It may or may not be related but I have to reset the heating system everyday as it seems to stop working but no fault codes appear.  

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We put ours on gas and it seems to last longer however we use the wash then rinse method

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9 minutes ago, Stevecol said:

Thanks for all the replies. We bought a Sprite Major 6td which has the truma combi 6 I believe. On the digital control I set it to boost and on mix 2 which is supposed to be 60 degrees heated by gas and electricity. I've never tried the shower as I'm 6ft 6 and 17st (really not designed for me☺) but she's told me it only lasts a couple of minutes. We've got the eco camel shower head fitted as standard.

It may or may not be related but I have to reset the heating system everyday as it seems to stop working but no fault codes appear.  

We have the same van as you - 2016 vintage - with the same setup as you (actually, I think we have the Combi 4 which is a lower output). We've not run out of hot water yet while showering. It's usually two showers in fairly quick succession, using the on / off technique. We've had it on various sources - Gas, Elec 2 and Mix 2 and we do usually specify boost (I think that just overrides the central heating for 30 mins).

We've had a couple of fault codes but they have always been associated with an airlock that's stopping the tank from filling or stupidity on my part (forgetting to turn the Master 240v switch on).

Conclusion - either your system is faulty (or not set right) or Mrs Steve needs to lower her expectations!

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Even if you wanted to add hot water to the Aquaroll, where would the hot water come from? The shower block I guess but that means filling the Aquaroll and wheeling it back to the 'van.

Edited by Pebble

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1 hour ago, Stevecol said:

Thanks for all the replies. We bought a Sprite Major 6td which has the truma combi 6 I believe. On the digital control I set it to boost and on mix 2 which is supposed to be 60 degrees heated by gas and electricity. I've never tried the shower as I'm 6ft 6 and 17st (really not designed for me☺) but she's told me it only lasts a couple of minutes. We've got the eco camel shower head fitted as standard.

It may or may not be related but I have to reset the heating system everyday as it seems to stop working but no fault codes appear.  

Try putting your Hot water on Boost with electric only, we found the water on our 2016 Sprite was hotter that way than using the Mix 2 setting

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Some folk use two Aquarolls.

John.     :)

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Pardon my ignorance but I have always understood that a domestic Combi boiler provides continuous hot water on demand and does not use a hot water storage tank.

If the above is correct does that mean that a caravan Truma Combi system, which appears to use a hot water storage tank, is not a true Combi system?

It seems to me that if it were a true Combi system the wife of the OP would only run out of hot water for her shower when the Aquaroll is empty. The solution to that would be to have two Aquarolls connected in series doubling output.  

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44 minutes ago, DeeTee said:

Pardon my ignorance but I have always understood that a domestic Combi boiler provides continuous hot water on demand and does not use a hot water storage tank.

If the above is correct does that mean that a caravan Truma Combi system, which appears to use a hot water storage tank, is not a true Combi system?

It seems to me that if it were a true Combi system the wife of the OP would only run out of hot water for her shower when the Aquaroll is empty. The solution to that would be to have two Aquarolls connected in series doubling output.  

Yes, it's not a Combi boiler in that sense. The Combi bit is from that it provides room heating and hot water from a single unit and also that it runs on gas and electric.

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28 minutes ago, svimes said:

Yes, it's not a Combi boiler in that sense. The Combi bit is from that it provides room heating and hot water from a single unit and also that it runs on gas and electric.

It seems to me to be a marketing trick.

I once had a 1985 Holivan 400 which was equipped with a bath. To serve the bath with hot water there was a 7Kwh gas geyser providing instantaneous hot water.

The so-called combi systems seem to me to a retrograde step for 'vanners who regard their caravans their as "home from home"

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12 minutes ago, DeeTee said:

It seems to me to be a marketing trick.

I once had a 1985 Holivan 400 which was equipped with a bath. To serve the bath with hot water there was a 7Kwh gas geyser providing instantaneous hot water.

The so-called combi systems seem to me to a retrograde step for 'vanners who regard their caravans their as "home from home"

The Combi 6 has a max has output of 6Kw. Given advances in efficiency I would assume that it can provide hot water at a similar rate to your "old geyser". Could be wrong though as it may be that the whole power output can't be directed to hot water alone.

I take your point that the labelling could be misleading to those used to the capabilities of a domestic  combi. I don't see how it's a retrograde step though. It's definitely better than our previous blown air system.

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Thanks for all of your feedback. There's a couple of options there to try. The aqua roll is nowhere near empty when my other half has had a shower. As the on board tank is only 10 litres I don't expect it to last too long but we were hoping for 5 mins or so. Thinking about it, although the tank has 10 litres of hot water as soon as you turn the tap on it will start cooling as cold water replaces it.

I do think we were a bit naive as well as when they said it was a combi I expected the water to go from the aqua roll and through a heater chamber/matrix thereby providing as much hot water as was in the aqua roll.

Does anyone else constantly have to reset their system for the hot water and heating to work?

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9 hours ago, DeeTee said:

It seems to me to be a marketing trick.

I once had a 1985 Holivan 400 which was equipped with a bath. To serve the bath with hot water there was a 7Kwh gas geyser providing instantaneous hot water.

The so-called combi systems seem to me to a retrograde step for 'vanners who regard their caravans their as "home from home"

It's not a marketing trick, it just means that it's a combined hot water and heating unit.  

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Steve - here's the theory as to how long Mrs Steve can shower. ...........

Assuming hot water at 60degC, cold at 10degC, mixed water (from the shower head) at 43 degC and a flow rate at the shower head of 3lt/min.  The make up of the water at the shower head will be approx. 2/3 hot, 1/3 cold. In the case of caravans, the limiting factor as to how long you can shower is the hot water supply as this is the lesser storage.

Using a flow rate of 3lt/min, that's 2lt/min of hot and 1lt/min of cold. So in theory, your hot water will last for 6 minutes, but, as you've rightly said, the stored hot water will decrease in temperature as fresh cold water is pushed into the hot water side of the Combi and that 6 mins will be reduced. To get a fast recovery rate and to, maintain as near to 60degC as possible, you need as much gas and electric oomph as possible, so using both heat sources does help.

HTH - time to educate Mrs Steve in shower times. lol? ;)

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I think the best solution is for Mrs Steve to stay at home !!! 😁

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13 minutes ago, Stevecol said:

I think the best solution is for Mrs Steve to stay at home !!! 😁

:goodpost::D

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I can manage a full shower, including my hair (yes I've still got some),  all the hidden bits and crevices  in about 90 seconds. Mrs Matelo can do it in about three minutes.

We lived in out van for four months in 2010 whilst we refurbed our bungalow and had to use the van facilities for most of that time whilst the plumbing was stripped and replaced. We never had a problem running out of hot water, even when I had to really scrub off after clearing insulation and rodents out of the loft space.

 

I suggest that a bit of shower training is required - it could save your household bills as well once the technique is mastered and used at home as well

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I cannot believe that a system normally capable of providing a shower for 2 people, is inadequate for 1 person. There must be something wrong with the system or the settings. We have never owned a caravan with a Truma Combi, but Truma is a great brand and they make acceptable products in  competition with the others, so their product is sure to be competitive.

You should discuss it with your supplying dealer and tell them you want it sorted.  

Edit: Our method for showering:

1. Get in shower enclosure with all that is needed and close the door.  

2. Lift the shower head off the wall bracket and point it at the floor, turn the water on and set temperature to hottest, as soon as it runs hot adjust temperature back from hottest to comfort level at mixer.

3. Put shower head back on wall bracket and get wet. Turn water off at shower head so that temperature control isn’t changed at mixer.  

4. Apply shower gell.

5. Turn water back on at shower head and get scrubbed and rinsed.

6. Turn water off at mixer.

This method avoids wasting water as well as avoiding wasting hot water.

We regularly get 2 good showers this way with the current Alde3020, and did with the previous Truma Ultrastore.

What you must not do is turn the shower on and run it until the mixed water seems correct before getting into the shower (as we do at home) because this would waste a lot of cold and hot water.

 

 

 

Edited by Ern

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Switch the heater off when she gets in and she'll soon learn not to dilly dally :lol:

 

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We have seen a person using a 12v fish tank heater in their aquaroll to try and extend the hot water time.   Truma do sell a boiler which is used in addition to the  normal boiler.   This boiler only works on EHU.   I think it holds about 14 litres.

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