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Cycle Lane Dilemma

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Yesterday in heavy traffic on a route I don't often use, there was a cycle lane alongside. The lycra set were happily wending their way along while I was stop start in a slow moving traffic jam (rush hour).

 

Every now and then I noticed the cycle lane seemed to disappear, sometimes crossing over the road at lights etc and at one point at lights where I was indicating left 3 cyclists shot up the inside, heads down looking neither right nor left.

 

So what is the right procedure? Not of course that it will make any difference. If we are turning left we should pull over towards the left side in normal situations and the chance of another vehicle undertaking is reduced. Where there has been or is a cycle lane that's negated - but where does the cyclist feature?

 

I found it pretty disconcerting and can see how the cyclist ends up under wheels.

 

 

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Reckon as cyclists are put on the road solely to test motorists reaction times both for the brakes and expletive utterances!

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If the lane is separated by lines, then you should give way to those in it.

 

 

there are some terrible designs though. The expensive and newly opened Leeds Bradford superhighway(!) Being one. This puts bus stop users and those in parked cars at rIsk from cyclists and cyclists at risk from motorists entering from side roads. It's also ilogical and much slower to use than the previouson-road lanes.

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If the lane is separated by lines, then you should give way to those in it.

 

 

there are some terrible designs though. The expensive and newly opened Leeds Bradford superhighway(!) Being one. This puts bus stop users and those in parked cars at rIsk from cyclists and cyclists at risk from motorists entering from side roads. It's also ilogical and much slower to use than the previouson-road lanes.

 

There is no argument there - after all the cyclist could die if we don't give way.

I was just a bit bemused at the lack of logic (there's that word again) that there am I relatively safely ensconced in metal and having to check all around before daring to move and the most vulnerable road user just whips along following his designated white line as if there is no-one else in the vicinity.

Surely the cyclist also has a duty of care even if it's only for his own life! I guess, should the worst happen, it will be the car driver who cops it for careless driving. How about careless cycling?

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Cycle Lanes. These are marked by a white line (which may be broken) along the carriageway (see Rule 140). Keep within the lane when practicable. When leaving a cycle lane check before pulling out that it is safe to do so and signal your intention clearly to other road users. Use of cycle lanes is not compulsory and will depend on your experience and skills, but they can make your journey safer.

 

140. Cycle lanes. These are shown by road markings and signs. You MUST NOT drive or park in a cycle lane marked by a solid white line during its times of operation. Do not drive or park in a cycle lane marked by a broken white line unless it is unavoidable. You MUST NOT park in any cycle lane whilst waiting restrictions apply. Law RTRA sects 5 & 8

 

look out for cyclists or motorcyclists on the inside of the traffic you are crossing. Be especially careful when turning, and when changing direction or lane. Be sure to check mirrors and blind spots carefully.

 

212. When passing motorcyclists and cyclists, give them plenty of room (see Rules 162 to 167). If they look over their shoulder it could mean that they intend to pull out, turn right or change direction. Give them time and space to do so. 213. Motorcyclists and cyclists may suddenly need to avoid uneven road surfaces and obstacles such as drain covers or oily, wet or icy patches on the road. Give them plenty of room and pay particular attention to any sudden change of direction they may have to make.

 

give motorcyclists, cyclists and horse riders at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car (see Rules 211 to 213 and 214 to 215).

 

 

The words "Sorry mate, I didnt see you", are still ringing in my ears after 32 years of cycling to work.

Edited by Upyonder
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:goodpost:

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Cyclists Head stone

 

"I had the right of way"

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I changed my route to work a few yers ago as i was convinced I'd knock a cyclist off at oe junction i went through &i would be blamed. In central London cyclists can use most bus lanes. My route in along Jamaica road has a bus lane along side it all the way but near the end of the road motorists have to do do a left on to druid st while buses can carry straight on. For the buses there is a set of lights triggered when a bus approaches. It doesn't trigger for cyclists as they are too small. The give way lines are on the bus lane not the road I'm using,but so many cyclists just plough on head down oblivious to the cars coming across their lane who have right of way.

I got fed up with the abuse even though I'd check & double check some of them think they're Bradley Wiggins & come. along at such a speed you don't see them.

Edited by Woodie106

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There is no argument there - after all the cyclist could die if we don't give way.

I was just a bit bemused at the lack of logic (there's that word again) that there am I relatively safely ensconced in metal and having to check all around before daring to move and the most vulnerable road user just whips along following his designated white line as if there is no-one else in the vicinity.

Surely the cyclist also has a duty of care even if it's only for his own life! I guess, should the worst happen, it will be the car driver who cops it for careless driving. How about careless cycling?

 

I don't know if there's a logic gap here. It's just that you are responsible and careful and some other road users aren't (they can be on bikes or in cars). There are definitely cases of careless cycling, luckily the most frequent victim will be the cyclist him/herself.

 

Most cyclists I see (the commuting ones) are very aware of their vulnerability and that the best way to mitigate that is to second guess what motorists might do. This can still be done whilst maintaining good speed!

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Cycle Lanes. These are marked by a white line (which may be broken) along the carriageway (see Rule 140). Keep within the lane when practicable. When leaving a cycle lane check before pulling out that it is safe to do so and signal your intention clearly to other road users. Use of cycle lanes is not compulsory and will depend on your experience and skills, but they can make your journey safer.

 

140. Cycle lanes. These are shown by road markings and signs. You MUST NOT drive or park in a cycle lane marked by a solid white line during its times of operation. Do not drive or park in a cycle lane marked by a broken white line unless it is unavoidable. You MUST NOT park in any cycle lane whilst waiting restrictions apply. Law RTRA sects 5 & 8

 

look out for cyclists or motorcyclists on the inside of the traffic you are crossing. Be especially careful when turning, and when changing direction or lane. Be sure to check mirrors and blind spots carefully.

 

212. When passing motorcyclists and cyclists, give them plenty of room (see Rules 162 to 167). If they look over their shoulder it could mean that they intend to pull out, turn right or change direction. Give them time and space to do so. 213. Motorcyclists and cyclists may suddenly need to avoid uneven road surfaces and obstacles such as drain covers or oily, wet or icy patches on the road. Give them plenty of room and pay particular attention to any sudden change of direction they may have to make.

 

give motorcyclists, cyclists and horse riders at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car (see Rules 211 to 213 and 214 to 215).

 

 

The words "Sorry mate, I didnt see you", are still ringing in my ears after 32 years of cycling to work.

 

I understand all that, and far be it for me to suggest that a cyclist's vulnerability be increased. I think cycle lanes are a good innovation. My worry yesterday was that cyclists seemed to think that the fact they had a designated lane meant they were invulnerable. There seemed to be little in the way of decreased speed at junctions etc which to me seemed madness.

 

It made me extremely nervous as they seemed to appear out of no-where a lot of the time. There was often no clear view back down the queue behind me, perhaps because the lane is so narrow other vehicles masked it. Crazy!

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I understand all that, and far be it for me to suggest that a cyclist's vulnerability be increased. I think cycle lanes are a good innovation. My worry yesterday was that cyclists seemed to think that the fact they had a designated lane meant they were invulnerable. There seemed to be little in the way of decreased speed at junctions etc which to me seemed madness.

 

It made me extremely nervous as they seemed to appear out of no-where a lot of the time. There was often no clear view back down the queue behind me, perhaps because the lane is so narrow other vehicles masked it. Crazy!

 

 

Whereabouts were you Toots? It may help us to understand better.

 

Here's part of the super-highway I referred to earlier (just before it opened actually). I'm still waiting for the first report of an injury to a bus stop user from a cyclist. I hope I never hear of one but I will be surprised if that is correct.

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I understand all that, and far be it for me to suggest that a cyclist's vulnerability be increased. I think cycle lanes are a good innovation. My worry yesterday was that cyclists seemed to think that the fact they had a designated lane meant they were invulnerable. There seemed to be little in the way of decreased speed at junctions etc which to me seemed madness.

 

It made me extremely nervous as they seemed to appear out of no-where a lot of the time. There was often no clear view back down the queue behind me, perhaps because the lane is so narrow other vehicles masked it. Crazy!

The rules Quoted from The HC apply to all road users. In the event of an accident their breach will assist in apportioning blame . . To whichever party

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What is the correct procedure for a cyclist on a one way street? Do they go with the direction of the one way or do they ride down into oncoming traffic? What happens if you as a motorist hit the numpty head on damaging your vehicle and injuring the cyclist?

Edited by Durbanite
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What is the correct procedure for a cyclist on a one way street? Do they go with the direction of the one way or do they ride down into oncoming traffic? What happens if you as a motorist hit the numpty head on damaging your vehicle and injuring the cyclist?

 

Probably best to sort it out with your insurance company and the cyclist. I assume you stopped to check they were ok and take their details?

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Probably best to sort it out with your insurance company and the cyclist. I assume you stopped to check they were ok and take their details?

I think it was a rhetorical question-like "what if pigs could fly?"

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I had to smile, the cycle lane was on my left and there was a single rider,

totally oblivious to the traffic riding _along_ the lane marking line!

I overtook him when I could get by safely but he caught up at traffic lights

where I was turning left. Indicators going I suggested to the Lioness that she

extend her arm in a left turn signal, which she did.

The cyclist stopped shook her hand and continued up the inside and crossed

the junction, I turned left and went on my way.

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I've yet to hear of any person who designs cycle lanes actually using them. You are right to be cautious driving among cyclists; there is a strong renegade element in some of them, especially if they cycle in groups. I don't like drop handlebars as they encourage cyclists to adopt a head-down streamlined position which is OK for the velodrome but inappropriate in traffic where the rider should be looking around. Unfortunately some cyclists are incapable of distinguishing between a training ride and a safe commute.

 

Try and follow Upyonder's post from the HC and the best of luck; there will be precious few cyclists doing likewise.

Edited by hawkaye
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I've yet to hear of any person who designs cycle lanes actually using them. You are right to be cautious driving among cyclists; there is a strong renegade element in some of them, especially if they cycle in groups. I don't like drop handlebars as they encourage cyclists to adopt a head-down streamlined position which is OK for the velodrome but inappropriate in traffic where the rider should be looking around. Unfortunately some cyclists are incapable of distinguishing between a training ride and a safe commute.

 

Try and follow Upyonder's post from the HC and the best of luck; there will be precious few cyclists doing likewise.

 

 

"Renegade element"?

 

That one made me chuckle.

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"Renegade element"?

 

That one made me chuckle.

Perhaps he means riding two abreast in sociable groups which they are perfectly entitled to do. :rolleyes:;)

 

I am very disappointed at the hostility being shown in this topic to vulnerable road users.

 

Perhaps the Social Club could have a sub forum named Road wars where these topics could be discussed?

Edited by DeeTee
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Perhaps he means riding two abreast in sociable groups which they are perfectly entitled to do. :rolleyes:;)

 

 

I don't think the reference was to those cyclists but to those that think their right of way is sacrosanct whatever the circumstances and are vociferous in declaring it.

 

Having driven a support van for a very long distance cycle event I was not surprised to see what some motorists are prepared to do to show their antagonism to cyclists despite them riding in a proper and safe manner.

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I used to cycle 32 miles a day from Cheshunt in Herts to Islington in London.

 

My route would take me along the A10, where through Enfield there was a cycle lane. I never used it, due to traffic turning across it to gain access to industrial sites and that it was always strewn with debris, including glass and sharp stones.

 

I took my rightful place, riding @ 20-25 mph, around a metre from the kerb, so avoiding drain covers and the road swept debris that could cause punctures. That metre gave me swerve room to get away from cars that came too close. Those cars would come too close even if I rode a few inches from the kerb and then I would be off!

 

Off carriageway cycle paths are dangerous for cyclists and should be on the main carriageway and where ever they are, they should be swept at least one a week.

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To clarify my intentions in this thread - we all have to use the roads and my concern was how to fairly cope with those who press on regardless of any imminent danger. I don't want to be responsible for anyone's injuries but would hope that cyclists would appreciate my dilemma in trying to avoid them!

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To clarify my intentions in this thread - we all have to use the roads and my concern was how to fairly cope with those who press on regardless of any imminent danger. I don't want to be responsible for anyone's injuries but would hope that cyclists would appreciate my dilemma in trying to avoid them!

 

As someone who often drives an HGV in London I can assure you that is unlikely to happen. :unsure:

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Yesterday in heavy traffic on a route I don't often use, there was a cycle lane alongside. The lycra set were happily wending their way along while I was stop start in a slow moving traffic jam (rush hour).

 

Every now and then I noticed the cycle lane seemed to disappear, sometimes crossing over the road at lights etc and at one point at lights where I was indicating left 3 cyclists shot up the inside, heads down looking neither right nor left.

 

So what is the right procedure? Not of course that it will make any difference. If we are turning left we should pull over towards the left side in normal situations and the chance of another vehicle undertaking is reduced. Where there has been or is a cycle lane that's negated - but where does the cyclist feature?

 

I found it pretty disconcerting and can see how the cyclist ends up under wheels.

 

 

To answer your question, might I suggest that you allow cyclists who are in your vision to get ahead of you to enable them to either cross the road or turn left when the traffic lights change. Some junctions at traffic lights have a dedicated lane at the side and an area in front stationary traffic in which motorists should not stop. This permits cyclists to have a cycle lengths start at T/L junctions. Sadly many motorists fail to observe the rule. :(

Edited by DeeTee
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To answer your question, might I suggest that you allow cyclists who are in your vision to get ahead of you to enable them to either cross the road or turn left when the traffic lights change. Some junctions at traffic lights have a dedicated lane at the side and an area in front stationary traffic in which motorists should not stop. This permits cyclists to have a cycle lengths start at T/L junctions. Sadly many motorists fail to observe the rule. :(

Unfortunately this set up encourages cyclists to ride up the inside of HGVs, regardless of the flashing LH indicator, voice warning that the vehicle is turning left and the large sticker on the back warning of the danger of this action. It may be relatively safe when the lights are showing red and traffic is stationary but they still do it when traffic starts moving. Cyclists MUST take responsibility for their actions.

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