Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Can any caravan of which the shell is a stiff box (solid construction ) on a flexible chassis stay in one piece without cracking The caravan would need to be built like a boat with a lorry chassis weighing much more.

Our roads apart from motorways are to uneven to expect any lightweight caravan to stay in one piece and be watertight. So what is the answer?

Rupert George

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 77
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

I agree. .. it doesn't matter what construction methods any of the manufacturers come up with, it all comes down to the people putting them together. I was also hopeful that our 2013 solid construct

I have a bit of interesting news regarding this. Yesterday, I was talking to a mate of mine who I haven't seen for ages, and he used to have his own business where he was a mobile AWS member. He was

Hi VOLVOVANNER With regard to your last sentence about the adhesive not sticking, in the videos on Elddis's website, it clearly shows them heating up a locker frame (similar to the heki frame) with a

Posted Images

I hope SoLID is the answer!! :rolleyes:

2011 Land Rover Freelander 2, Lago grey 2013 Freelander Dynamic Black, followed by a 2013 Elddis 574 Magnum GT white

Link to post
Share on other sites

I hope SoLID is the answer!! :rolleyes:

Me too! When I chinned one of the Elddis production team at the NEC about the doors on my van all being out of alignment when I picked it up. He blamed it on the van getting a good shake during transport. Complete tosh! I have caravanned extensively in and around Belgium and some of those roads seem to have had little attention since WW2. If they dont shake your doors and rattle your fillings, nothing will.

 

On the plus side, a couple of years on and all seems well.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Have a look at Elddis's test video! ;)

2011 Land Rover Freelander 2, Lago grey 2013 Freelander Dynamic Black, followed by a 2013 Elddis 574 Magnum GT white

Link to post
Share on other sites

IMHO SoLID can never be the the answer. Wood and aluminium are intrinsically incompatible. Wood expands when even slightly damp and contracts when dry, aluminium expands when warm and contracts when cold. Whatever you do to join them has its job cut out . In addition, many of the leaks in conventional caravans are between the aluminium skin and the rubber window surrounds allowing damp to get at the wooden frame.

 

The best, possibly only, solution is to avoid having wood, or wood based products, in critical areas.

 

 

edit:typo.

Edited by Stevan
Link to post
Share on other sites

Although a bit of an Elddis fan, I did look at other makes when we updated our caravan to a SoLiD version earlier on this year. I read CT daily and have seen few reports of the solid body/window surrounds leaking since its inception in 2013(?). Hope I am not tempting fate.

It seems to me that whether it leaks or not is more down to how the individual caravan was made on the day rather than the construction method. I can see that some processes especially those without timber in the structure wont suffer so much if water does get in. ......but I still like the Elddis (Buccaneer) design/product so bought one and so far so good. ...touch wood.

  • Like 1

Powrtouch AWD Movers. E & P Compact Levelling System.

Link to post
Share on other sites

As I understand it, as long as the bonding process is carried out correctly then water cannot get in. The only downside that I can see is they rely on someone with a mastic gun to apply it, and that is where it can fail.

 

I still believe that this bonding method is the best form of construction, it has been used in the aircraft industry for a while and when was the last time you seen a plane fall apart.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Although a bit of an Elddis fan, I did look at other makes when we updated our caravan to a SoLiD version earlier on this year. I read CT daily and have seen few reports of the solid body/window surrounds leaking since its inception in 2013(?). Hope I am not tempting fate.

It seems to me that whether it leaks or not is more down to how the individual caravan was made on the day rather than the construction method. I can see that some processes especially those without timber in the structure wont suffer so much if water does get in. ......but I still like the Elddis (Buccaneer) design/product so bought one and so far so good. ...touch wood.

I agree. .. it doesn't matter what construction methods any of the manufacturers come up with, it all comes down to the people putting them together. I was also hopeful that our 2013 solid construction van would give us years of touring without having to worry about ingress but unfortunately on Sunday morning my worst fears came true.

 

Popped out to our van in storage and discovered damp 2/3rds of the way around the front Heki :-(. There is a very light tide mark on the ceiling and hard bumps of fungus have started to appear under the surface. Looks like it has been building up for a while but was dry during the service in May. Too early to say what the source of the leak is, will be taking it to the service centre soon for them to check it out and contact Elddis. I have sent them the photos and spoke to them today on the phone.

 

Buying a van really does appear to be a lottery these days, once this is sorted out I am debating givIng up the hobby altogether. The van is not even 3 years old yet and I can't see it lasting more than 5 with all the problems we have had so far. Selling it and buying from another manufacturer just means buying a new lottery ticket, think I might have had enough of that game.

 

Mark.

  • Like 2

Bailey Unicorn 3 Barcelona

Hyundai Santa Fe Premium 7 seater

Link to post
Share on other sites

As I understand it, as long as the bonding process is carried out correctly then water cannot get in. The only downside that I can see is they rely on someone with a mastic gun to apply it, and that is where it can fail.

 

I still believe that this bonding method is the best form of construction, it has been used in the aircraft industry for a while and when was the last time you seen a plane fall apart.

In the aircraft industry they bond metal to metal, or metal to composite, not metal to wood!

Link to post
Share on other sites

In the aircraft industry they bond metal to metal, or metal to composite, not metal to wood!

 

True, but the point I was making was as long as the bonding is applied correctly it shouldn't leak.

Link to post
Share on other sites

 

True, but the point I was making was as long as the bonding is applied correctly it shouldn't leak.

 

Exactly!

2011 Land Rover Freelander 2, Lago grey 2013 Freelander Dynamic Black, followed by a 2013 Elddis 574 Magnum GT white

Link to post
Share on other sites

IMHO SoLID can never be the the answer. Wood and aluminium are intrinsically incompatible. Wood expands when even slightly damp and contracts when dry, aluminium expands when warm and contracts when cold. Whatever you do to join them has its job cut out . In addition, many of the leaks in conventional caravans are between the aluminium skin and the rubber window surrounds allowing damp to get at the wooden frame.

 

The best, possibly only, solution is to avoid having wood, or wood based products, in critical areas.

 

 

edit:typo.

I am fairly sure that Elddis use GRP in construction and not aluminium panels?

Link to post
Share on other sites

I am fairly sure that Elddis use GRP in construction and not aluminium panels?

Aluminium, ABS or GRP, the problems are similar, they do not move the same way as wood or wood based materials. Any attempt to join them to wood w ill fail unless it either keeps the wood at a constant level of humidity or allows it to move. Even wood to wood joints fail unless they allow for wood's characteristic movements! Builders of wooden boats know this only too well and build accordingly.

Link to post
Share on other sites

So if you could post your proof that every van that has been made with wood has leaked it would be most interesting, Im not saying not using wood is not better, but i am sure the industry would have not been using wood in vans and most still do since the start of caravan time.

People should not scare monger, saying every van made from wood will leak is utter popy cock. Every van made from any material will leak eventually so how long are we talking here???

 

Kev

Aluminium, ABS or GRP, the problems are similar, they do not move the same way as wood or wood based materials. Any attempt to join them to wood w ill fail unless it either keeps the wood at a constant level of humidity or allows it to move. Even wood to wood joints fail unless they allow for wood's characteristic movements! Builders of wooden boats know this only too well and build accordingly.

Edited by Kevin H

Kev H<p>Ford Transit Custom Campervan closely followed by a Lunar Lexon 640

Link to post
Share on other sites

Can any caravan of which the shell is a stiff box (solid construction ) on a flexible chassis stay in one piece without cracking The caravan would need to be built like a boat with a lorry chassis weighing much more.

Our roads apart from motorways are to uneven to expect any lightweight caravan to stay in one piece and be watertight. So what is the answer?

Rupert George

IMO you have hit the nail on the head, there is a great incompatibility between constructing a rigid box and plonking it on an inevitably flexible chassis. It "racks" the joints between these semi rigid panels, and with conventional construction that's okay whilst the jointing compound is thick and flexible enough to accommodate the movement. But if it is there it is often too thin a smear and frequently a product that hardens as it ages, then disaster is just round the corner.

 

So we need to bond joints with a lovely thickness of a compliant, low degradation bonding product, so the bonding being supple enough to live with the flexing. Or use corner joints [like extrusions] that themselves can flex; as do Bailey and now Swift. IMO by far more reliable in the long term than than even the use of thick flexible bonded seals.

Me I would not touch SoLid construction; IMO they have missed the point and kept much that is flawed.

Edited by JTQ
Link to post
Share on other sites

In tolden days the mastic was softer and had some give, now its very strong and the only thing that gives is the abs panels.

 

Plus the fitters of the caravan parts should be those who want a job for life and not those who're after a few weeks/months money.

Paul B

. .......Mondeo Estate & Elddis Avanté 505 (Tobago)

Link to post
Share on other sites

So if you could post your proof that every van that has been made with wood has leaked it would be most interesting, Im not saying not using wood is not better, but i am sure the industry would have not been using wood in vans and most still do since the start of caravan time.

People should not scare monger, saying every van made from wood will leak is utter popy cock. Every van made from any material will leak eventually so how long are we talking here???

 

Kev

I have not said that "every van that has been made with wood has leaked". Many failed joints do not leak and for many vans the joints do not fail for years. On my many trips round caravan dealers over the years, I have found very few, if any older (15 years plus) vans that have been totally dry and many, much younger, that have been thoroughly wet and rotten.

 

I stand by my opinion that wood is basically incompatible with more modern materials and SoLID has yet to prove me wrong.

Link to post
Share on other sites

What does this say then.

any attempt WILL fail, does that not mean all or should it read a lot of attempts????

 

Ill still stand by my statement as well, manufactures would not still be using wood if it was no good and they all are on nearly all their ranges in 1 way or another

Also your theory is flawed as you cannot compare 15 year old vans with 15 year non wood structure vans yet

. Any attempt to join them to wood w ill fail unless it either keeps the wood at a constant level of humidity or allows it to move. Even wood to wood joints fail unless they allow for wood's characteristic movements!

Edited by Kevin H

Kev H<p>Ford Transit Custom Campervan closely followed by a Lunar Lexon 640

Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree. .. it doesn't matter what construction methods any of the manufacturers come up with, it all comes down to the people putting them together. I was also hopeful that our 2013 solid construction van would give us years of touring without having to worry about ingress but unfortunately on Sunday morning my worst fears came true.

Popped out to our van in storage and discovered damp 2/3rds of the way around the front Heki :-(. There is a very light tide mark on the ceiling and hard bumps of fungus have started to appear under the surface. Looks like it has been building up for a while but was dry during the service in May. Too early to say what the source of the leak is, will be taking it to the service centre soon for them to check it out and contact Elddis. I have sent them the photos and spoke to them today on the phone.

Buying a van really does appear to be a lottery these days, once this is sorted out I am debating givIng up the hobby altogether. The van is not even 3 years old yet and I can't see it lasting more than 5 with all the problems we have had so far. Selling it and buying from another manufacturer just means buying a new lottery ticket, think I might have had enough of that game.

Mark.

Great shame you have the stress of this problem Mark. It would be interesting to know how the joint failed ie did the SoLiD bond fail or was there insufficient bonding applied at manufacture or has the frame of the Heki cracked? This problem could befall owners of any caravan regardless of manufacturing technique could it not as all Heki roof lights will be fitted in same fashion i guess.

Hope you can get sorted soon and with no further problems.

 

Do pls keep us informed as to the problem.

 

V V

  • Like 1

Powrtouch AWD Movers. E & P Compact Levelling System.

Link to post
Share on other sites

In the aircraft industry they bond metal to metal, or metal to composite, not metal to wood!

The older aircraft B707/DC8 etc had loads of balsa/alloy sandwich panels and they are still used in many industries but different grades of foam can now more or less replace the timber completely.

Edited by Motobiman

Adventure before dementia.

Saving for a Caravisio !!

Link to post
Share on other sites

This problem could befall owners of any caravan regardless of manufacturing technique could it not as all Heki roof lights will be fitted in same fashion i guess.

 

Yes, but the ramifications could be very different depending on the materials involved in the roof/ceiling construction.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Exactly!

I think it's more to do with the design of the joint as well as it being properly carried out.

 

I'm sure there has to be some flexibllity . ....... O

Adventure before dementia.

Saving for a Caravisio !!

Link to post
Share on other sites

I am fairly sure that Elddis use GRP in construction and not aluminium panels?

 

Hi DTio. They might well now use GRP but in the days prior to SoLiD they used aluminium for the side panels.

 

Memories are short but remember the continually reported splitting of the aluminium at the same place on some of the long single axle models and some variants of the twin axle models.

 

That said - I am unaware of any splitting having occurred with the sides since the introduction of SoLiD but there again they have change some or all of the chassis to AlKo and the splitting was associated with the BPW chassis mounted bodies.

Life in general can be a journey of chance with some winners and sadly some losers. Your outfit can never be left to chance. A short-while carrying out essential checks can ensure a long-time of happy & safe caravanning for all concerned.
Ignorance can often be bliss but is certainly not an excuse and when continually disregarded they can be totally disastrous for oneself and the innocent parties.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The older aircraft B707/DC8 etc had loads of balsa/alloy sandwich panels and they are still used in many industries but different grades of foam can now more or less replace the timber completely.

Balsa is a strange wood, very light, flexible and spongy. Easily capable of being constrained by being bonded to other materials. More of a spacer to hold the alloy panels apart than structural in its own right, hence replaced by foam.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...