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About Lutz

  • Rank
    Over 1000 posts

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  • Gender
  • Location
    Hochheim am Main, Germany
  • Interests
    Foreign travel and technical issues
  • Towcar
    2016 BMW X4 30d
  • Caravan
    2008 Dethleffs Beduin 545V

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  1. Three Plates On My Wagon

    What is a 'slightly overloaded' caravan? Slightly over the label by the door, slightly over the plate in the front locker or slightly over document that came with the caravan? And how much is slightly? And how about a driver who has not got 50 years under his belt?
  2. Three Plates On My Wagon

    I think you have summarised the situation quite well. However, I don't think that you are going to get a definitive reply from anyone here in the forum to help you get out of the mess that Bailey has got you in. Short of possibly contesting a case in court I can only suggest that you contact Bailey and ask for their explanation why, a ) the EU Certificate of Conformity (1374kg) does not tie in with the statutory plate (1500kg), and b ) why a new statutory plate and a new EU Certificate of Conformity weren't issued when the details on the doorside label were changed to 1450kg. Both issues could be a major stumbling block if a Bailey caravan were ever to leave the UK permanently and registered elsewhere. I suspect that as far as Bailey were concerned, they are of the opinion that the NCC Certificate of Compliance (and the corresponding label) covers everything, but it would be interesting to know what was the basis for their judgment. For sure, an actual gross train weight under 3500kg is not going to help you with regard to meeting B licence requirements. Legislation in that respect is quite clear.
  3. Three Plates On My Wagon

    I've been weighed and found to be over the limit, but I wasn't fined. As expected, they measured the axle load and and checked that against the plated axle load, but not against the MTPLM. Then they asked me if I knew what the noseweight was. I said it was at the 75kg limit (which it probably was). According to their arithmetic I was 135kg over the limit on the MTPLM. All I had to do was to empty the fresh water tank and move the cooler box from the caravan and into the car. That seemed to satisfy them because I wasn't re-weighed, but allowed to go. I was probably still over the limit slightly then, but they obviously allowed me a margin of error.
  4. Three Plates On My Wagon

    If the caravan isn't unhitched then they can't determine its total weight, but they would need that to compare with the MTPLM. If they are only measuring the axle loads (which I presume is the general rule) and compare that with the plated MTPLM, then they would be letting a lot of outfits that are actually over the limit go without reprimand.
  5. Three Plates On My Wagon

    As neither the doorside label, nor the statutory plate, nor the EU Certificate of Conformity tie up with one another, the only conclusion that one can reach is that Bailey have really got things screwed up. Of course the manufacturer can set his own weight limits, but unless they are in a format that complies with what the law prescribes, what consequences can result from disregarding them? How can maximum permissible axle loads be on one plate and the MTPLM on another? There are no provisions for such in legislation, which only refers to one statutory plate. Besides, the type approval limit is also a limit set by the manufacturer. It's not one set by any type approval authority. They only document it. For B licence holders it's not the plated GTW limit that counts but the sum of the GVW and MTPLM. That's the way the law is written. The plated GTW can be way over 3500kg and yet the outfit B licence legal.
  6. Three Plates On My Wagon

    But the plate near the door doesn't give details of any axle loads, so what the powers-that-be are measuring if the caravan isn't unhitched can't be compared with what's on the plate.
  7. Three Plates On My Wagon

    But from what we can gather from Kilham5's replies, the statutory plate in the locker doesn't tie up with the EC Certificate of Conformity, so it does look as though Bailey have really screwed things up here.
  8. Three Plates On My Wagon

    You are quite right. It is a great big muddle. Bailey seem to missing the point that the NCC Certificate of Compliance does not override the EC Certificate of Conformity. The NCC certificate only confirms that certain industry standards are met, but it is completely independent of type approval. Type approval documents will be filed with the respective type approval authority. However, judging by what has been described in the course of this thread, I have my doubts whether Bailey ever submitted any documentation to cover a change to the MTPLM to whoever carried out the type approval in the first place (Société National de Certification et Homologation s. ár. l, Luxembourg, in Bailey's case?) so that their files are kept up-to-date as well. If the original EC Certificate of Conformity does not cover the uprated MTPLM then I would presume that Bailey would have to have a new type approval done or at least amended, including possibly even a new type approval number being issued. Perhaps Towtug knows about about the procedure in such cases.
  9. Three Plates On My Wagon

    Whatever any plate says, whether it's the one in the gas locker or the one next to the door, it's the maximum axle load and the MTPLM that is documented in the EC Certificate of Conformity that counts. That is the document that must be produced when registering a caravan on the Continent, for example. They do not necessarily have a look at any plate when issuing the paperwork to crosscheck whether they agree (although they should).
  10. Three Plates On My Wagon

    Out of interest, what does the EC Certificate of Conformity say as regards MTPLM as does that, at least, agree with the statutory plate?
  11. Not really because the front and the rear wheel can be at different heights on the leading and trailing ramp.
  12. Yes, but if you have any concern, you could put two ramps back to back and have the front wheel on one and the rear on the other. In other words, one would be making a hump out of two ramps. You just have to take precautions that a gap between the ramps doesn't occur as one wheel moves across from one ramp to the other in the process. The two ramps don't necessarily have to face in the same direction.
  13. There's no need to raise both wheels by the same amount.
  14. I can't quite see the need for the black part to have to be between the wheels. Surely both wheels will be on the same leveller, just one a bit further up the ramp than the other. The red bit is only necessary if the black alone doesn't raise the side of the caravan enough
  15. Maybe the tyres, although all of the same nominal size, are from different tyre manufacturers in which case there can be small differences of up to a couple of millimetres in overall size. However, if you are talking about a difference in rolling radius by as much as 1", that would suggest that the nominal size of one of the tyres is different, too. There should not be a difference between the left and right hand side.